When did your Timing Belt break

Maintenance/Repairs
21

Never had one break on me but can relate experience of friends:

  1. 1992 Volkswagen Passat. Timing belt broke at 57,000 miles causing $3000 in engine damage. Specified change time was 60,000 miles. Dealer very reluctant to processs warranty claim. Said may neighbor, 5’-0" female, “abused” the car. Owner vowed NEVER TO BUY ANOTHER VW.

  2. Nissan pickup, about 110,000 miles, original belt. Owned by son of friend of wife. Had a panic call at 11 pm that truck “just stopped” with lots of gas, good battery, and would not restart. Advised to have vehcle towed to nearby garage owned by friend, who confirmed broken belt next morning.

22

I don’t remember people having all the problems with timing gears and timing chains back in the 1950’s that we have with failed timing belts today. I also don’t remember all the problems with blown head gaskets that people report today.

Yes, but in the 1950s and early '60s a car getting to 100,000 miles was unusual, and probably had to have a valve job or something in that time. A chain would be better, sure, but you really don’t want to get overly nostalgic about those good old '50s cars. They had their weak points too.

23

“A chain would be better, sure, but you really don’t want to get overly nostalgic about those good old '50s cars. They had their weak points too.”

Yup, you don’t need the whole 50-60s package; just be sure to buy any newer car with a chain, not a belt.

24

1964 Buick Special with V-6 engine. Timing chain with nylon sprockets. The teeth wore off the sprockets and the car jumped time at 80,000 miles. I was almost home after driving from work. Coasting down a hill to my driveway and the engine stopped. Coasted into my driveway. I bought and installed new sprockets and chain. No damage to engine. I had bought the car used with 40k miles on it. An old fellow that I worked with told me at the time that I’d have this exact problem at 80k miles. He knew of several other folks that owned the same car with the V-6 engine.

By the way, the GM V-6 in those days ran very rough. When GM decided to produce a V-6 they simply lopped off 2 cylinders from their V-8, but didn’t bother to redesign the crank shaft. The crank throws (and power pulses) were uneven.

I have talked to a couple folks with modern (1985 or later) GM V-6 engines where the timing chain broke and the engine was ruined. That’s why I scoff when I hear someone say that “timing chains last forever”. It’s simply not true.

25

True, timing chains don’t always last forever. Mine, on a 1984 Chev Impala 305 V8 got noisy, with diesel-like rumble at 160,000 miles. My mechanic suggested changing it NOW and replaced it with double metal gear set, better than the plasic single gear original. Cost $200+, and car is still running on replacement set. Timing chain on my 1994 Nissan still going strong; no instructions in owners manual for inspection or replacement.

26

I hope you two replaced that rear end exploder on the spot and NOT the belt. (Chuckle)

27

I will concede that we certainly do less maintenance on today’s cars than we did in the cars of the 1950’s and 1960’s. A 2000 mile oil change and new spark plugs and distributor points was the norm. I owned a 1954 Buick Special in the early 1960’s that my dad purchased in 1955 from the original owner. It had 160,000 miles when I sold it and had never had the head or pan off the engine. It didn’t burn oil and ran very well. We should have been able to build on the good qualities of the 1950’s and 1960’s cars and not have introduced the problems created by timing belts that fail and head gaskets that blow. As I remember,Ford tried using aluminum heads on the flathead V-8’s and ran into head gasket problems. We should have learned from this about the combination of a cast iron block with aluminum heads.

I do remember being able to go to the auto parts store and exchanging a worn out carburetor or a worn out generator for a rebuilt unit for $12-$15. This is probably equivalent to $60-$75 in today’s money. I know that the 1950’s cars had their weak points, but I felt more confident in handling the problems.

28

I was cruising in my 1970 Volvo with the B20B engine on the 405 around Long Beach when the cam gear came apart. I was motorvating along when a clattering began in the engine followed by complete loss of power. As I coasted to the breakdown lane, declutched, the engine stopped turning. Subsequent investigation showed that the fiber cam shaft gear had lost about 4 or 5 teeth which dropped into the oil pan. The engine had about 130K miles on it so I went ahead with a rebuild.

29

"When GM decided to produce a V-6 they simply lopped off 2 cylinders from their V-8, but didn’t bother to redesign the crank shaft. The crank throws (and power pulses) were uneven.

And, when they decided to produce a 4 cylinder for the accursed original Pontiac Tempest, they literally lopped off half of a Pontiac V-8, thus producing a similarly unbalanced engine.

I knew someone with a '61 Pontiac Tempest 4-cylinder, and the timing chain could be heard hammering against the timing chain cover by something like 40,000 miles. After he replaced it at around 45k, he subsequently replaced it again at around 80k when it again began hammering against the timing chain cover.

And, that crappy swing-axle rear suspension used to eat up tires about every 11,000 miles. That Tempest looked nice, but it was really a piece of crap from an engineering standpoint.

Anyone who thinks that GM’s engineering in the 60s was better than today is sadly deluded.

30

Nope, I was way too poor and that was a VERY reliable car. I kept it until the floor rusted through while I was in Philadelphia.

31

And, that crappy swing-axle rear suspension used to eat up tires about every 11,000 miles. That Tempest looked nice, but it was really a piece of crap from an engineering standpoint.

Since tires generally lasted only about 12,000 miles back then, 11k isn’t so bad.

At least then car manufacturers were willing to try new things. As I recall, it wasn’t just a swing axle, but a rear transaxle with LSD. In 63 you could get it with the 326. Too bad it didn’t carry over to the 64 GTO.

32

My Cousin Vinnie

33

1988 Dodge Omni at abut 40k miles. I bought the car new so knew for sure the odometer was correct. I was driving on an interstate about 5 miles from home, on the way to work, going about 65 mph. Instantly there was a drastic loss of power, but the engine still ran slowly. I got off at the next exit and slowly drove it back home. The engine would not rev much higher than an idle. I had it towed to the Dodge dealer. The service manager told me the car had jumped time, perhaps because the timing belt tensioner hadn’t been properly adjusted when the engine was built. His intent was to simply re-install the belt on the same sprockets. I insisted on a new timing belt. Unfortunately I was not there when the work was done so don’t know what really happened at the garage. I drove the car to 106k miles without further timing belt problems.

34

I do recall that the original tires on my father’s '66 Galaxie 500 only lasted about 12,000 miles, but on the other hand, the original tires on his '63 Plymouth were good for well over 30,000 miles. It all came down to brand quality in the long run.

And, since my friend made the mistake of buying expensive tires for his Tempest (and since he did not rotate them), the front ones were good for over 25k, while the rears were worn out (only on the inner edges of the tread) by 10k or 11k. On this car, it would have been necessary to rotate them very frequently if they were to wear anywhere near evenly.

The Tempest featured a rear-mounted transmission and it was touted as having “perfect balance” as a result of having more weight in the rear than RWD vehicles normally do. However, very few owners (or independent mechanics) ever thought to check the transmission fluid by pulling up the trunk mat and removing a cover in order to access that transmission dip stick. The result was early failure for all too many of those transmissions. While I am not positive about this one point, I don’t think that the car featured a LSD.

Rather than use a conventional drive shaft with a couple of u-joints, GM used a flexible shaft (I forget the term for this) that ran in a couple of bearings underneath the car. The bearings were placed so that the shaft actually curved underneath the car as it went from the engine to the transmission.

The placement of the transmission in the rear meant that the flexible drive shaft was turning at engine speed, and at highway speeds, this meant that you had this thing whipping around underneath the floor at 3,000 rpm, and maybe as high as 4,000 rpms. When the bearings gave out (well before 50,000 miles) the racket underneath the car was incredible from the combination of that inherently unbalanced engine coupled with the high speed of that driveshaft. If this was occurring at the same time as the timing chain was hammering against the timing chain cover, it sounded like you were riding inside a garbage can, with someone banging on the outside of it.

That original Tempest was indeed very innovative. Unfortunately, back in those days (and for many years following) GM used the consumer as their testing staff and failed to fully develop their innovative technology prior to putting the vehicle on the market. The car was cute, and it got pretty good gas mileage. Unfortunately, it was a piece of crap and that is why very few survived for more than a few years.

Today’s GM products actually tend to be much better in quality than GM’s half-baked innovations of the '60s

35

My brother and I were driving his 1983 Dodge Ram (a mini mitsubishi pickup) down the last long hill toward his place in the country, and the truck just shut off . . no power. We were going about 60mph, 5th gear, cold January of 88, about 50k on the clock. Nice and warm engine, no problems before that. We coasted to a stop, hitchhiked to his place, got my car and a tow strap and pulled it into his barn. Disassembled and replaced in about a day, must’ve been a non-interference, no damage . . it ran for another 150k before he sold it. From that pont forward I changed my timing (and other) belts before the max time/mileage of the manufacturer . . . thought it was easier to do on a nice day than in a cold barn in January. Rocketman

36

BTW . . just checked Gates website . . the recommended change is 60K . . . go figure. However, my brother is kinda tough on vehicles, so this may not be a good indicator. Rocketman

37

Early Toyota Camry 5-speed. Belt broke at about 135k miles. Driving through town (gently) on my way to dinner with friends. Halfway down the block, maybe 25-30 mph, the belt broke and the engine died. No engine damage.

Son’s Ford Escort timing belt broke as he pulled away from a stop light. Normal driving, not racing. Mileage about 75K. Again, no engine damage.

Since then we’ve learned to replace timing belts BEFORE they break.

38

There is only one cam belt on a Legacy.

39

I’m off the subject but people are talking about chains. 9-20-'00: '76 Dodge 1/2 ton pickup. RWD. 318 CID. Approx. 100,000 mi. on odo. Mack Blvd, Allentown, Pa. Trying to get to my Aunt’s funeral. Slammed on brakes when guy pulled right in front of me. Stalled; thought gas sloshed in carb. Unloaded choke, cranked but NG. Desperate men take desperate measures: ran down battery; bought cheap one at a Pep Boys.

This time I burned out starter. Spent the night at my cousin’s apartment. Next day- truck towed. Outfit charged me 2 days storage even though truck was there 12 hours. (calender days) Tow truck driver was nice guy, towed me over to a street where I wouldn’t get towed again- NC. Discovered pickup coil flopping around on breaker plate. That’s it! Installed new distributor. No chgange. Heart dropped to feet.

Rented Chevy pickup from Enterprise place. Drove to shop I worked at in Lancaster, Pa. and threw my tools in and headed back to scene of the crime. Intermittent spark. W/#1 cylinder on TDC, rotor pointed directly at #1 cap electrode, so chain couldn’t have jumped. (Fatal assumption) Fuel OK. W/Chevy & jumper cables charging Dodge I cranked it over every 5 minutes. For hours. Desperate men… Finally

it fired. Why? Test drove around block. Died up steep hills. Tried to visualize the route to Lancaster- no steep hills. Returned Chevy and rolled into shop 1 1/2 hours later. Now my mind was like mush. (I was on vacation.) In DESPERATION I got my old trade school textbook, “Engine Repair and Rebuilding- Shop Manual” [General procedures]; and turned to: “What a vacuum gauge can tell you”. It took me

right to “valve timing off”. When I got down to the chain it was one tooth retarded, which was unbelieveable considering the condition of the cam sprocket teeth (nylon sprocket). Most likely original chain. Put on one of those double row chains w/steel gears. Maybe the initial cranking caused a 2-tooth jump and a backfire made it jump back one? Mystery. Rod bearings went less than a year later. Triedag, lars46 and others are right- chains w/non-metal gears stink, probably worse than belts.

40

1999 Volvo V70 - broke Aug 2006 at 70K (recommended service interval 105K). It’s not really clear to me exactly when it broke - I was driving on the highway, and when I stopped to drop off a friend, the car was making lots of noise. But I stupidly drove home another 20 miles, and even drove about 5 miles the next day before the car wouldn’t start, and I had it towed in. Cost me $2600 to repair the damage to the valves, cylinder head, etc. Volvo refused to pay even a penny towards the repair.

What’s really frustrating is that it just happened again last week - has anyone ever heard of a failure of a 1 year old timing belt??? I don’t know yet whether it damaged the valves & head again (still waiting for the mechanic’s report). Is there anything that a driver does that causes such a failure, or is it a random event?