The wolf in sheep's clothing EVs vs ICEs

The buy-back for power is determined at the end of the year. It isn’t charged in real time, hourly or monthly. If you generated more from your solar than you used in your home, you get paid the 1/3 rate. If you use more than you generate, you pay the regular kWhr rate.

That is called net-metering. It makes solar financially viable.

Discussing this sort of issue on arguments in a completely fantasy based set of assumptions gets us nowhere. So, here’s some facts from my electric bill.
My electricity costs me 55.427 cents per kWh at peak times (5pm to 8 pm for me). It costs 33.435 cents per kWh off peak. There are other fees added of course, and taxes.

I have a solar array that has been operating since April. In July, a very sunny month with long days, it generated 639.6355 kWh from 12 panels. Of course, those all came during the sunlight hours, and they were sent into the electric company grid. I used just about 400 kWh, so the electric company owed me a credit for the excess generated. That system cost me, net, about $16,000. I paid that, not the electric company or the taxpayers of America. Nobody thanked me. And I fed it into the grid at my house, so it was available for my neighbors to use (and for them to pay the electric company for it). Because of my solar array the power supply of my neighborhood was increased, at no cost to the neighbors or the electric company. You’re welcome.

Every new residence built in California must have a solar generation array, as do some commercial buildings.

With the technology we have now I can’t see how we can do away with gasoline as a fuel in the next 10 years. Our geography is so spread out, and our population so compressed there’s no simple solution. But there are solutions that are being developed while we are sitting here writing our posts.

Why not put solar array panels as roofs over freeways? Here in California we could have solar panels as roofs over irrigation canals and open air water canals like the ones that carry Sierra water from 500 miles away to Los Angeles. Lots of retail businesses and schools and office buildings have solar panel roofs over their parking lots, creating shade and recharging vehicles during the day while their owners are working or shopping. These sources would create electric power and it would be created all over, not just a power plants, so distribution would be more diffuse.

As long as we get fed the nonsense that is in post 1, we will not answer the real questions.

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Where abouts do you live in CA? LA is around $0.25/kwh:
Average Energy Prices, Los Angeles-Long Beach-Anaheim – August 2021 : Western Information Office : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics (bls.gov)

How so low? No AC? No hot water? I use 4.5x that with a 21 SEER AC unit. July daily highs are 95 all month long. If I turned the AC off, I’d still be hard pressed to meet 400 kWhr a month.

Also seems like you should be seeing about 50% more from your solar figuring 300w per panel, 12 panels and at least 250 hours of sun in July or 900 kWhrs.

Solar is all well and good until the sun doesn’t shine. At that point something else is required.

If we think batteries for cars will take a lot of lithium and cobalt. Imagine if every house had to have storage batteries as well.

Or they could make it like my state, where the utilities are for some reason allowed to charge me a “solar fee” every month if I put panels on the roof, regardless of how much I generate. -eyeroll-

I regret that I have but one “thumb” to “up” at this.

But there’s other dams, other rivers.
Climate change can itself make it harder to switch to behavior that mitigates climate change.
A possible vicious circle.

I have deleted my original post that started this discussion thread.

I failed to do due diligence in verifying the article’s claims thereby posting highly biased, erroneous information.

My apologies. I shall be more careful going forward.

Marnet

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You sure about that rate. the HIGHEST electric rates in the US is Hawaii at $0.32kwh. What country do you live in?

The upfront cost is very high.

And you would have to light the freeways. So Nevada gets more than 81% of its electricity from fossil fuels. How will adding electric cars there help our greenhouse problem?

my 2 cents… while EV might help I think we should put just as much or more effort in protecting our coral reefs. While coral reefs only cover 0.0025 percent of the oceanic floor, they generate half of Earth’s oxygen and absorb nearly one-third of the carbon dioxide generated from burning fossil fuels. if we don’t it wont matter what you drive.

That was from the second quarter of 2021. There are 8 solar farms scheduled to come on line during the next two years with an output totaling more than 2100 megawatts.

Hmm, Nevada could change the electronic slot machines to mechanical. Incorporate a small generator in the slot machine, each pull of the lever would generate electricity. :grinning:

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Hydroelectric comes from the Hoover Dam, and a significant portion of that electricity goes to Nevada. Here’s the breakdown:

Area Percentage
Metropolitan Water District of Southern California 28.53%
State of Nevada 23.37%
State of Arizona 18.95%
Los Angeles, California 15.42%
Southern California Edison 5.54%
Boulder City, Nevada 1.77%
Glendale, California 1.59%
Pasadena, California 1.36%
Anaheim, California 1.15%
Riverside, California 0.86%
Vernon, California 0.62%
Burbank, California 0.59%
Azusa, California 0.11%
Colton, California 0.09%
Banning, California 0.05%

The dam was built to service the entire Southwest and not just Nevada as you know.

You also mentioned the solar farms in another post. I saw them flying into Las Vegas this past summer. Calling them immense doesn’t do justice. Absolutely jaw dropping from the air. We were still at about 5000 feet, and even one solar farm was way too large to fit in the 737 window.

There is a powerplant at Davis dam as well but hydroelectric accounts for less than 3% of the energy supply used in Nevada.

MGM resorts built a 100 megawatt solar farm that is expected to provide 90% of the daytime energy needed for their 13 properties.

OK, let me explain a bit more. First, I live in the San Francisco bay Area, in Oakland. I looked at the same Federal report for this area and, indeed, in April (when the Federal report was written) I was charged $0.25791 per kWh, off peak; $0.27671 peak. Rates keep going up, and then we pay more in the Summer. The rate in my September bill is $0.28313 and $0.37809.

I miscalculated the first rates I gave. My electric bill is complicated because of NEM, and because the generation charges are actually going to a Community Electric program and the bill contains elaborate charges and credits. The electric companies credit me for the power I generate at the same rate as they charge for electricity, but they also charge a daily delivery charge of $0.33260 a day and other fees that add up to about $10.00 a month.

Finally, we use gas for cooking, heat, hot water, and the clothes dryer. We use electricity for AC, a jacuzzi tub and the refrigerator as well as all the usual incidentals. No electric car. Our climate is very moderate, average morning temperature in summer is 55, high is 74 at our house. It does get hotter occasionally and also smoky so we do use the AC from time to time. It’s set to 78. In the winter it’s low of mid 40’s and high in the mid to upper 60’s. No freezing, no snow. It’s foggy here a lot, especially in July and August, so solar production is reduced.

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Oh wow. AC set to 78. Do that here and you’ll start sticking to the leather sofa :grin:.

My only real complaint with the SE. If I ever relocate, I hope it’s somewhere more arid or just cooler in general.

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We use two window AC units. Both at 78F.
Den and bedroom. Cool one during day, the other at night.
Cool nights 70 y.o. Vornado house fan (see my avatar).
Re sticky at 78: oversized AC system doesn’t reduce humidity less well.
Our top month this year used 570Kwh. Winter months ~180Kwh.
Gas stove & hot water. Gas boiler for heat.
No dryer: clothesline in & out.

A solar powered dryer got one for the wife she didn’t think it was funny. :smiley:

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I have lived in Florida long enough that 78 F is just fine. In fact, much lower and I’m cold! :cold_face:

The AC runs enough to de-humidify the house down to about 50% running mostly on the 1st stage of a 2 stage AC unit. My next AC will be a fully variable compressor. Boosts the SEER from 21 to 24 if I remember correctly.