# School Bus Safety **URL:** \ **Category:** Safety\ **Created:** [May 17, 2018, 10:40pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586 "2018-05-17T22:40:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![VDCdriver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/vdcdriver/32/30_2.png) [@VDCdriver](https://community.cartalk.com/u/VDCdriver)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2018, 4:23pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/21 "2018-05-23T16:23:27Z")
Yup! In the aftermath of fatal car accidents, it is not unusual to read that the dangerous driver had had his/her license suspended… 8… or 10… or 15 times, and some of those people had been driving for only a few years. Are some of those suspensions for a few weeks? How can one have his/her license suspended… let’s say… 10 times if he/she has only been driving for perhaps 7 years? This has always puzzled me. And, you are correct that I have never had my license suspended. In fact, it has been over 10 years since I even got a traffic ticket, and that was for making an illegal left turn in NYC, at an intersection that was so dark it was impossible to see the sign stating “no left turn”. ---
**Author:** ![wentwest](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/wentwest/32/6073_2.png) [@wentwest](https://community.cartalk.com/u/wentwest)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2018, 4:32pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/22 "2018-05-23T16:32:11Z")
As long as jobs like school bus driver are paid so poorly, and treated as such menial jobs, the only people willing to take those jobs will be drawn from a pool that includes some very unqualified people. It’s amazing that this type of tragedy happens so rarely. And New Jersey should be praised for requiring seat belts. They do work, as this event seems to prove. ---
**Author:** ![eddo](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/eddo/32/2594_2.png) [@eddo](https://community.cartalk.com/u/eddo)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2018, 4:45pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/23 "2018-05-23T16:45:17Z")
> [@VDCdriver](#): > > **the entire body of the bus separated from the vehicle’s frame.** > > Is this typical of how school buses are built by the companies that assemble them? > 🤔 Not typical of bus accidents, but it is not as bad as it appears. The body bolts sheared off, or broke- consuming impact energy from the dump truck. The box of the bus stayed together, helping to protect the passengers. From the reports of what this lame brained driver tried to pull off, it is pretty apparent that this bus saved lives. Pulling in front of a full speed dump truck probably should have taken more lives than it did. ---
**Author:** ![the\_same\_mountainbike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@the\_same\_mountainbike](https://community.cartalk.com/u/the_same_mountainbike)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2018, 7:18pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/24 "2018-05-23T19:18:37Z")
> [@shadowfax](#): > > I think the article is asking the wrong question. The problem here isn’t that the guy is old, it’s that he’s an idiot and has been for decades, seeing as the first of his 14 license suspensions was in 1975. In fairness, most of those suspensions were non-driving related (though the last one listed, which was for driving on a suspended license, points to the idea that this guy just doesn’t give a hoot about rules), but that said, I’m willing to bet none of us here have had our license suspended even once, for any reason, much less 14 times. I absolutely agree. With a record like his, he definitely should not have been driving a school bus. Or even a lawn tractor. I never even had a parking ticket until a few years ago. I did have two speeding tickets in the '80s in western Massachusetts, where the cops who don’t write tickets don’t get promotions. I was told that by a cop in the region. One of my tickets was bogus, the other was just west of Rt. 2 where the divided highway speed limit drops down but the highway stays divided for more miles, a speed trap design fi ever there was one. Never had anything more serious than the above. Never even came close to losing a license. ---
**Author:** ![TwinTurbo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8baadc/32.png) [@TwinTurbo](https://community.cartalk.com/u/TwinTurbo)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2018, 8:27pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/25 "2018-05-23T20:27:11Z")
Around here, the number of kids on buses has gone down, dramatically, over the years. The buses still run but most parents choose to drive their kids to/from school. This results in miles of back ups as the line of cars in/out of the school lot affects traffic greatly 2x a day. At some schools, they even have cops directing traffic. Back in my day, all kids in a neighborhood walked to a common pick/drop off spot. Nowadays the bus stops at every home which can be excruciating if you happen to be behind one… ---
**Author:** ![tom418](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/da6949/32.png) [@tom418](https://community.cartalk.com/u/tom418)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2018, 8:40pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/26 "2018-05-23T20:40:54Z")
“Stop at each street corner?” Where I live, buses stop at each house!. They will literally stop and one house, open door, kid gets on, close door, and then do the same at the house right next door, 150 feet away. ---
**Author:** ![VDCdriver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/vdcdriver/32/30_2.png) [@VDCdriver](https://community.cartalk.com/u/VDCdriver)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2018, 9:12pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/27 "2018-05-23T21:12:07Z")
> [@tom418](#): > > Where I live, buses stop at each house!. They will literally stop and one house, open door, kid gets on, close door, and then do the same at the house right next door, 150 feet away. Well, thank God that the Powers-that-be in my area are a bit smarter than those in your area. I say that because our local school buses have pickup/drop-off points approximately every two blocks. In theory, the kids have to walk a couple of blocks, but–as you might imagine–that type of trek is considered to be onerous nowadays, with the result that ~90% of the parents drive their kids to and from those pickup/drop-off points. There are always 3 or 4 vehicles idling at the bus stop, so that the kids don’t have to brave the dangers of a neighborhood with zero crime. 🤔 ---
**Author:** ![MikeInNH](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a587f6/32.png) [@MikeInNH](https://community.cartalk.com/u/MikeInNH)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2018, 9:12pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/28 "2018-05-23T21:12:29Z")
> [@TwinTurbo](#): > > Around here, the number of kids on buses has gone down, dramatically, over the years. The buses still run but most parents choose to drive their kids to/from school. Sure that’s the reason? Population of kids around here is way down from a decade ago. Some schools use to have 2-3 classes per grade from 1st thru 6th, and now they are down to 1-2 classes. ---
**Author:** ![TwinTurbo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8baadc/32.png) [@TwinTurbo](https://community.cartalk.com/u/TwinTurbo)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 2:01am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/29 "2018-05-24T02:01:01Z")
Our school population had leveled off but is rising for the last 4 years and again next year. One thing is obvious driving by during drop off or pick up times- the line of cars is growing noticably YoY. The buses have fewer kids. Big debate because the car people don’t want to fund buses. Just like the private school crowd does not want to also fund public school. ---
**Author:** ![oldtimer-11](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/e79b87/32.png) [@oldtimer-11](https://community.cartalk.com/u/oldtimer-11)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 5:17am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/30 "2018-05-24T05:17:20Z")
The age limit for school bus drivers in NY state used to be 65. The Americans with Disabilities Act changed that. Nor there is a physical performance test that school bus drivers must pass. It includes pulling a 140 pound weight in a burlap sack along a rubber mat similar to the aisle between the seats the length of the bus. Getting on and off the gas and brake so many times in so many seconds. Starting in the drivers seat with the key in the ign., undoing the seat belt openig the door, getting down on the groung with both feet and back up in the seat with the belt latched in so many seconds and finally from the drivers seat with the belt on , down the aisle to the back door and out the back door with both feet on the ground in so many seconds. I was 75 when I lost the center of vision in one eye and could no longer drive a bus. We had one driver who passed the physical test at 86. The driver in the crash was the bottom of the barrel, but what can school districts and bus companies do when they are all advertising heavily for drivers? The school district I drove for was the best company I ever worked for. they never asked you to speed or hurry and if the run took more time than was scheduled, they paid you for it… They offered more than state required safety training and paid you for it. Yet they have had critical driver shortages for more than 20 years even though they require all mechanics and transportation office employees to have the bus licenses and physicals and NY 19A certification. ---
**Author:** ![sgtrock21](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/sgtrock21/32/246_2.png) [@sgtrock21](https://community.cartalk.com/u/sgtrock21)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 6:35pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/31 "2018-05-24T18:35:21Z")
The school bus driver’s record indicates chronic poor judgment. This horrific accident which was so easily preventable is the “Mother of poor judgment”! I’m going to propose a scenario and ask one question. I’m confident all forum members, past and present commercial drivers, and hopefully over 50% of other drivers know the correct answer. It applies to interstates and other limited access highways. You miss your exit or in this case choose the wrong on-ramp. What do you do? The only correct answer is continue to the next exit where you can safely cross over or under the highway returning to the exit you missed or in this case continuing to your destination. I just don’t get it. ---
**Author:** ![VDCdriver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/vdcdriver/32/30_2.png) [@VDCdriver](https://community.cartalk.com/u/VDCdriver)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 6:38pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/32 "2018-05-24T18:38:25Z")
> [@sgtrock21](#): > > You miss your exit or in this case choose the wrong on-ramp. What do you do? The only correct answer is continue to the next exit where you can safely cross over or under the highway returning to the exit you missed or in this case continuing to your destination. While that is clearly the only correct answer, it always amazes me when I see someone backing-up on the shoulder of an interstate highway because they missed an exit. Apparently, these people believe that if they continue to the next exit, they will fall into some kind of mysterious black hole from which they will never emerge. I don’t get it either… ---
**Author:** ![VDCdriver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/vdcdriver/32/30_2.png) [@VDCdriver](https://community.cartalk.com/u/VDCdriver)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 6:58pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/33 "2018-05-24T18:58:17Z")
Upon the driver’s release from the hospital, he was greeted by detectives from the Morris County Prosecutor’s Office and was notified that he is being charged with two counts of **vehicular homicide**. He is on his way to the county jail, and will be arraigned in Superior Court tomorrow. If convicted–which is extremely likely–he could be sentenced to a term of 5 to 10 years in the state penitentiary. > **[N.J. school bus driver charged with vehicular homicide in crash that killed 2](https://www.nj.com/morris/index.ssf/2018/05/school_bus_driver_in_fatal_crash_charged_with_vehi.html)** > > Hudy Muldrow Sr., 77, allegedly attempted to make an illegal U-turn on Interstate 80 and the school bus was hit from behind by a dump truck killing a teacher and student ---
**Author:** ![shadowfax](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/shadowfax/32/13026_2.png) [@shadowfax](https://community.cartalk.com/u/shadowfax)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 7:02pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/34 "2018-05-24T19:02:31Z")
I mean, that’s great and everything, but I still suspect that this guy is a moron. Literally stupid. I don’t think it should necessarily be criminal to be literally stupid. It should be criminal to knowingly put stupid behind the wheel of a school bus. I’d like to see them going after the fool who decided someone with his abysmal driving record was a good fit for a school bus driver. How many other morons have been plopped onto school buses by that person? How many other kids are one idiotic decision away from a crash? ---
**Author:** ![jtsanders](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c2a13f/32.png) [@jtsanders](https://community.cartalk.com/u/jtsanders)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 7:17pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/35 "2018-05-24T19:17:26Z")
> [@shadowfax](#): > > I don’t think it should necessarily be criminal to be literally stupid. It should be criminal to knowingly put stupid behind the wheel of a school bus. Being stupid is not criminal, but perpetrating criminal acts is illegal no matter how stupid someone is. The wife’s cousin’s husband is a public defender and has been for decades. He says that most of his clients are duped into committing crimes. They are too dim witted to understand and then they take the fall for the crime boss. He never tries to get them off. After all, they committed a crime. He does try to get the sentence reduced due to the circumstances. ---
**Author:** ![shadowfax](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/shadowfax/32/13026_2.png) [@shadowfax](https://community.cartalk.com/u/shadowfax)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 7:19pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/36 "2018-05-24T19:19:39Z")
I’m not saying he should be absolved of legal consequences for what he did. I’m saying it’s not going to solve the core problem, which is that some dope hired him to do that job in the first place. I mean, you don’t hire someone who can’t swim to be a life guard. If you did hire someone who can’t swim as a life guard and they let someone drown, that would at least be partially on the guy who hired the life guard. ---
**Author:** ![VDCdriver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/vdcdriver/32/30_2.png) [@VDCdriver](https://community.cartalk.com/u/VDCdriver)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 8:48pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/37 "2018-05-24T20:48:08Z")
> [@shadowfax](#): > > I’m saying it’s not going to solve the core problem, which is that some dope hired him to do that job in the first place. There are sure to be Civil Suits against the local Board of Ed and its transporation supervisor, and under the legal principle of _Respondeat Superior_, the Board could well be held liable for civil penalties. This moron undoubtedly doesn’t have any resources that could satisfy a civil suit, but whoever is in charge of the school transportation department–as well as the school district–could be liable for big bucks. ---
**Author:** ![tom418](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/da6949/32.png) [@tom418](https://community.cartalk.com/u/tom418)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 8:49pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/38 "2018-05-24T20:49:12Z")
Back in 1972, one Joseph Larkin decided to drive his bus across railroad tracks in Congers, N.Y., while there was a train approaching. I was in High School back then myself. If I recall correctly, he got only probation after killing five students on the bus, and injuring others (by injuring, i mean injuries requiring amputations, etc.). ---
**Author:** ![VDCdriver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/vdcdriver/32/30_2.png) [@VDCdriver](https://community.cartalk.com/u/VDCdriver)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 8:52pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/39 "2018-05-24T20:52:13Z")
> [@tom418](#): > > Back in 1972, one Joseph Larkin decided to drive his bus across railroad tracks in Congers, N.Y., while there was a train approaching. I was in High School back then myself. If I recall correctly, he got only probation after killing five students on the bus, and injuring others (by injuring, i mean injuries requiring amputations, etc.). I don’t claim to be familiar with NY State Law, but I think that there is a very good chance that in the ensuing 40+ years, there are now statutes on the books in NY that are similar to those in NJ. ---
**Author:** ![bing](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/bing/32/4619_2.png) [@bing](https://community.cartalk.com/u/bing)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2018, 9:00pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586/40 "2018-05-24T21:00:12Z")
Well I think it’s called negligence. I’ve known a few stupid people and really they were very nice and responsible. You had to help them along though so they wouldn’t get taken advantage of. Being stupid does not make one a bad driver but being uncaring about your responsibility as a human and a driver does. Elites sometimes mistake their superior intellect as being necessary to be a conscientious driver. [Previous page](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586.md?page=1) [Next page](https://community.cartalk.com/t/school-bus-safety/117586.md?page=3)