I would still buy a reputable filter
Don’t buy “white box” filters of dubious quality . . .
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When you look at the viscosity on the oil bottle, the first number be it 0W, 5W, 10W, etc… is the WINTER weight.
This means the oil will flow at that viscosity down to zero degrees. Below that, the oil starts to thicken. Full synthetic oil doesn’t start to thicken until it reaches -40-50 degrees.
But at that temperature, nothing moves anyway.
I’ve maintained my 97 Accord since it went out of warranty with original owner. And the engine has seen nothing but 5W-30 regular oil.
It’s now got 230,000 miles on it and running strong.
Synthetic oil? Application specific.
Tester
I remember that when the first oil with the current two letter grading system was released, either Popular Science or Motor’s published a chart that assigned names to the different letter grades. For example, SA was “service austere” and SE was “service extreme”. I don’t remember the names in between, and I’ve been all over the web trying to find them with no success. Anyone remember them?
I would think an engineer would know that there is no such thing as break fluid.
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It’s hard to goof up refining and packaging oil. It’s quite easy to cheap out on materials and workmanship on an oil filter and get away with it. So, I would buy most any oil that is properly rated and specified for my daily drivers but I certainly wouldn’t buy the cheapest filter I could find…
Also some vehicles require a weight that is only available as a synthetic or blend. My highlander’s oil recommendation is 0w-20. Can only get that as a synthetic.
And I’ve yet to hear an answer on how that’s done. Synthetic blend is a mixing full synthetic oil and regular dino oil of the same weight. Since 0W-20 doesn’t come as regular dino oil, then how do they make the blend.
Tester gave a good list of reasons to use synthetic oil above. Only other reason is because the manufacturer recommends synthetic oil.
Royal Purple is a waste of money. Your engine will not last one more minute than if you serviced it with whatever is API rated off of the parts shelf.
I routinely run my cars to 300 or even 400k miles on nothing more than motor oil from Wal Mart. Same goes for the daughter’s 05 Mustang which at 225k miles is still near perfect.
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It’s ironic that this this is a Car Talk forum and Ray Magliozzi says use synthetic and extend your intervals. He points out that frequent changes puts a huge load of used oil and filters on the environment and that you can trust the automotive and chemical engineers.
Yet everyone on this thread seems to know better. So you can decide who to believe. The fact is synthetic lubricates better and longer and is far more resistant to sludge. It has tremendous scouring ability and will clog a filter with all the crud left behind by conventional oil. That’s why Royal Purple says you need to change more often at first.
Because he wants to learn.
I would suggest to believe your own eyes and make your best judgement rather than blindly follow advise from either camp.
Checking oil level regularly is a must, same as following manufacturer recommendations during warranty period, after that one can do as he’s pleased.
Having said that, I would not wait for 10K miles or 6 month or whatever threshold if with my own eyes I observe oil too dark or having “wrong” smell (like burnt or diluted), even if it is too early by the 10 commandments of either camp.
If environment conservation is of particular concern, the waste from having oil changed “too early” will be far offset by the impact of the engine and car failing prematurely and requiring disposal. Something tells me that oil recycling is much better established nowadays than proper car materials recycling.Oil component may be too much of the “shiny object of the current moment”, while I would suggest to look at the bigger picture.
That depends on where you live I guess. I return my oil to my towns transfer station. My town has waste oil burners in all the DPW buildings.
Would you show me the auto manufacturer that says you can extend the oil change interval if you use synthetic. I’ve never seen it. In fact I have seen manufacturers owners manual say to NOT extend oil change interval if you use synthetic oil.
What crud left behind conventional oil? If you abused your engine then maybe. I use synthetic oil in my Highlander because 0W-20 only comes as synthetic (sometimes blend). My previous SUV’s I used synthetic oil because of towing in the summer and skiing in the white mountains during winter where it’s not unheard of to wake up to -30. But my wife’s cars all used convention oil and all reached at least 300k miles before we sold them. Not one was burning oil and they all ran great. One we gave to our niece for college and she sold after graduation with it with over 400k miles (still running great). I just followed the manufacturers recommendations.
If I can get 300k + miles on conventional oil with no engine issues, then based on your assumption you should be able to reach 600k miles with no issues.
Ray said to extend your drain intervals because of the 3000 mile recommendation of oil change places, he certainly was not talking about extending them to 12 to15 thousand miles especially since most people pay no attention to the time element.
Why stop at Royal purple? Mobil one has an oil they claim is good for 20000 miles in one year. I don;t try and out guess the car manufacturer. I don’t trust oil companies that make claims that exceed what the car manufacturers say, just to induce you to buy their oil.
Not until I see a lot of credible evidence from known independent testing labs. Don’t try to fix what ain’t broke.
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It’s hard to see the bigger picture sometimes. In fact, most oil filters are disposed of in the trash. Have you considered how many are actually consumed every year? Many sources of information available but by and large, you could figure 500 MILLION filters are in use at any given time. How much steel and how much waste oil that does not get recycled? How about 9 MILLION gallons of oil. Everyone tends to think local, myself included. But when you look at the much bigger picture, it’s a LOT of waste oil and steel just in the filters. We’ve been through this discussion several times at least on this site and there are strong feelings on both sides of the equation. It’s hard to argue against the fear of losing an engine and to default on the side of extra caution. But understand, there is an environmental price being paid and it’s not inconsequential…
Here’s what Toyota has to say. I’d follow their advice before anyone here, including Ray:
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Only Toyota vehicles in which 0w-20 synthetic oil is required have been approved for extended oil change intervals of 10,000-miles/12-months. (However, you should continue to check the oil level regularly and top off if needed. That will help your engine get the full benefit of synthetic oil.)
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Vehicles in which 0w-20 is an option to 5w-20 mineral oil, (or 5w-30), will continue to require 5,000-mile/6-month oil change intervals, even if 0w-20 oil is used.
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In the case of vehicles with 10,000 mile oil change intervals, the 5,000 mile service interval has not been eliminated. The traditional 5,000 mile maintenance procedures (such as tire rotation) will continue to be required, and the fluid levels (such as brake fluid) will need to be checked and adjusted at this time.
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If the vehicle operation meets the standard criteria for “Special Operating Conditions” such as: driving off-road, on dirt roads, towing a trailer, making repeated short trips under 32˚ F, or extensive idling; the engine oil must be replaced at 5,000 mile intervals, regardless of what type of oil is used.
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That’s one reason I like the filters in my Highlander and wife’s Lexus ES-350. All you replace is the filter media…no steel goes to the landfill.
As for oil…I’m not going to exceed the engine manufacturers recommendations. You can experiment if you want to. Manufacturers have already extended oil change intervals at least three times since I started driving almost 50 years ago. In 10 years this argument may be moot as more and more manufacturers are making electric vehicles. More electric vehicles replacing ICE vehicles will drastically reduce waste oil. Batteries are improving every year and charging stations are popping up every day. Electric vehicles are not just a good commuter vehicle.
The only advantage synthetic oil has over dino oil is that is more resistant to heat. It is not more resistant to dust, humidity, and combustion debris. If you allow the oil to run chronically low then you’ve eliminated any advantage the synthetic had.
Those who work on cars routinely run into things that make the average mechanic say what in the hxxx were they thinking.
One of my favorites was the VW electrical engineers who worked out the glow plug system for the diesels.
4 Glow plugs with an a 80 amp surge and constant 40 amp draw. And for this they use a 50 amp fuse.
One would that thought that at some point one guy would have raised his hand and queried whether this was going to be a problem. It will last through warranty and then get towed in…
Synthetic oil also flows better in extreme cold…a LOT better. At -30 convention oil is almost a molasses. Synthetic oil still flows well. Before synthetic oil people who lived in these temps would either invest in a block heater, or if they lived in an apartment they’d drain their oil on nights temps would get the cold and bring it in the house. Then pour the warmer oil back in the next morning. Third option was to never shut the vehicle off for the night.
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that option also was exposed in good aftermarket remote start systems as the option to start engine on the schedule, like for 15 minutes every 2 hours
I don’t see a problem. Fuses will take a surge 2 to 4 times their rating.