The problem with roundabouts is that they are usually, in the US at least, designed by traffic engineers who are clueless. We tend to use them to slow down traffic, not make the traffic flow more efficient. They are used inconsistently, even in the same new development, and the signage is counterintuitive. You won’t get drivers trained on how to use them properly if they are installed inconsistently.
Europe has the “luxury” of having had them around for a long time. The western US hardly has any. I, personally, don’t like them. I don’t want some idiot hitting my car because they got confused even if it is only a “fender bender”.
BTW, serious accidents at intersections are caused by drivers not paying attention. The same inattentive driver will still cause a serious accident in a roundabout. Just imagine a driver talking on a cellphone, or reading a map and plowing into a roundabout at 35mph. You think it will result in any less carnage?
You can find Car and Driver columns taking the opposite position, also. My point was that statistics and accident rates seem to favor circles over stoplights, and indicate better traffic flow rates for circles. Sure, anything can be overwhelmed with too much traffic, but a stoplight won’t make that situation better.
I’ve seen, and driven through, roundabouts and rotaries with lots and lots of traffic. They work fine. It looks crazy, but it does work.
All I have to do is show ONE rotary that doesn’t work to prove my point…Here’s one…Concord NH and drive through the Rt 2 Rotary…I defy you to drive through there every day for 2 months during rush hour and NOT see an accident. I can’t tell you how many times I was almost killed going around that thing.
Having actually driven in the UK and through a number of western European countries and quite a few Central European countries I will say:
Roundabouts work best with light traffic. With heavy traffic, lights end up getting installed and then the mess is just spread around the entire roundabout. The British seem to like to use them as often as possible, even when a regular four-way intersection would be more appropriate.
I’ve never found roundabouts to be confusing or difficult. When the view is fairly clear on an approach (and there are no other cars on the roundabout or coming in slightly before you) you can sail through an intersection at about 20 mph if it’s “straight” through.
Is this the same Italy I’ve heard of? On another automotive forum there’s a guy asking about extra plastic guards for his new car (a Citroen C4) because of how people park and open their doors …e.g. without concern for other cars.
I’ve lived in Poland for the last three years and it is rare to see “5 lanes of traffic on a 2 lane road” but it is fairly common to see people exceeding a 45 mph speed limit by 20 or more mph, in the city. Very, very common actually. And parking wherever they please.
"The problem with roundabouts is that they are usually, in the US at least, designed by traffic engineers who are clueless. We tend to use them to slow down traffic, not make the traffic flow more efficient."
Boy you hit a sore point with me on this one. In Nashville, they put highway department trucks on he freeway, driving about 20 mph, in such a manner as to block one or two lanes of traffic, creating hugh traffic jams. It’s done to reduce traffic. I cannot follow that logic at all.
They also can’t seem to finish the 840 loop so that a lot of traffic can bypass Nashville’s downtown. This is being blocked by all the country music stars that live in and around Franklin, they don’t want the freeway near their horse farms. Since it hasn’t been finished yet, it won’t be finished because the pollution levels are too high in the Nashville downtown area. Keeping more traffic in the downtown area is going to make the situation better?
I can think of two things that would improve traffic flow, and therefore reduce gas consumption.
One would be to provide a Mapquest type of service to truckers that would not only help plan their route, but set up timing so that the trucks avoid hitting cities during rush hour. It would be better for them and the rest of us too. Almost like adding extra lanes.
Second would be developing cameras attached to traffic lights that are connected to a computer. The computer would monitor traffic and adjust the light timing to allow the maximum of traffic flow. Some of the current systems seem to be designed to slow down traffic and make everyone stop as often as possible.
Ok guys, I don’t give a rats rear end about roundabouts or traffic circles. If they use them here in the states, ok by me. My problem with this whole thing is the posts that say us Americans or Canadiens are to stupid to use them. There is no logic for that line of thought. We cannot use them right now because we don’t have that many.
Guess what, when Europeans come over here and encounter a typical intersection they may be a bit scared of that since they may not have any expierence with them. Does that make them stupid foriegners? No way.
If you talk to a European that came over here they most likely have a good job that requires a good head. I say that to remind people there is a stereo type that says Europeans and others are smarter than us and that is not true. You only talk to the smart ones since they have the ability to come over and discuss items like automobiles and driving habits. You never have the opportunity to talk to the “not so amart ones” about these things. So with that said us North Americans are not so dumb that we cannot handle roundabouts, we just need to learn them if they are installed where a person drives. I am afraid I have not articulated my words properly to get my point across but I hope all can decipher my meaning.
A comment was made a roundabout is safer since it will avoid T-bones and the like. Well there still will be T-bones and other bad wrecks since turning the wheel is still required and people still will not be 100 attentive just because there is a roundabout.
With all due respect to our European neighbors, just because Europe does something does not make it better. Example, a co-worker went to Greece, a part of Europe, and while he was relieving himslef in a unisex public restroom a female came in to the stall across from his, no doors, eliminated and reached around to wipe the waste from her bottom and flung it to the ground. Then left. This was a gross example but my point is just because Europe does something does not make it better.
I am not jumping anybodies case so please do not get defensive about this. It just bothers me when people say something like “we are to dumb to understand that”.
Round-a-bout is not the same as rotary. While in some situations rotaries may work well, there are places where they IMO should never be used, and since drivers can be confused with the difference, I would suggest there should be no rotaries.
All I have to do is show ONE rotary that doesn’t work to prove my point…Here’s one…Concord NH and drive through the Rt 2 Rotary…I defy you to drive through there every day for 2 months during rush hour and NOT see an accident. I can’t tell you how many times I was almost killed going around that thing
If your point is that rotaries and round-a-bouts are unsafe, one example based on your personal experience does not provide much evidence that all round-a-bouts are unsafe. Maybe it is your driving skills, or maybe it is a poorly designed or placed rotary or the fact that rotaries are not round-a-bouts.
We have a roundabout less than an hour from here. I have used it without incident. It is near a school and sometimes it is very busy and other times, not. It seems to me that accidents, should they occur, would be less severe than at the 55mph T-intersection, there previously.
However, people with limited sight, limited walking ability, or other disibilities (could be you or a loved one, someday) have a tough time crossing at busy roundabouts. There have been cases where intersections have been replaced by roundabouts, traffic lights removed, and some of our citizens have lost some of their independence. Lawsuits have followed. This is something to be considered early in planning stages.
Not everyone can deal with traffic like the winning frog on a “Frogger” game.
It’s the SPEEDS at which people drive in the roundabouts which make them dangerous. The local roundabouts have posted speed limits of 15 mph. Many drivers drive 30 mph to 50 mph in the roundabout. People are speeding to pass people in the roundabout, who are, themselves, driving ABOVE the posted speed limit; so, they are not those “slow-pokes” getting into the “self-important” person’s way. These drivers pass on the left, or the right, IN the roundabout. Try to get YOUR exit with somebody passing you, on your outside, at speed, in a roundabout.
Of the approximately 20 people that responded,
4 think rotaries are bad
4 think rotaries are good
many think some are bad and some are good
many think many rotaries are poorly designed
many think most drivers need to be trained to use rotaries
Meanyedcatz thinks everyone is simply stupid
In summary, nobody agrees.
But I’d have to ask those that think drivers need training to use them if that in fact is not evidence that their a poor design?
Maybe the reason I don’t mind them is that all the ones I deal with are only one lane in width. I suspect the ones that are hated by others here are two or more lanes. That’s also why I was thinking “What’s the problem here, why are they so difficult?”
And since I don’t know, what really is the difference between a roundabout and a rotary? Looks like I mistakenly thought the terms were interchangeable.
Come on the same mountainbike. Read it again and you will see that I said that no one is stupid. I said that WE ARE NOT STUPID as other earlier posts did say we are. I re-read my post and I did not even elude to that.
Come on, did you read it again?
Ah, very good, see, you understand now. I said we are not.
Maybe these traffic circle things just need more time to evolve. Lots of things start out round and then morph into some shape or dimension that nobody is even thinking about, yet.
I know that I used to have to “cruise” I-75 with a tennis racket (top part was round) between the seat and the accelerator, before the modern type, fancy push-button cruise was invented. I could not have invisioned a scenario in which a tennis racket would morph into electronic cruise control (square buttons) built right into my steering wheel!
I say, let’s not argue, step back, and see what these circle things evolve into. I can picture something more along the lines of a figure-eight or something similar, maybe a different number.
If your point is that rotaries and round-a-bouts are unsafe, one example based on your personal experience does not provide much evidence that all round-a-bouts are unsafe
That’s just one…IN fact I’ve yet to see the rotary that’s SAFE. I GUARANTEE YOU that when you drive through the Concord (it’s MA not NH) during rush hour you’ll be white knuckle and and swearing you head off at the 500 cars that cut you off as you were trying to exit the rotary. MOST people who take that rotary for the first time have to drive around 2-3 times before someone entering the rotary decides to yield to let them in. People get frustrated that rotary because they’ve been backed waiting in stop and go traffic for the past 10-20 miles waiting go through it.