I’ve seen enough of these situations to know that betting money on engine damage is a safe bet.
It’s also quite possible that the facility involved with that oil change could balk and deny responsibility but in the end they are going to be on the hook for any repair costs.
You have not stated how many miles on the car but being as it’s a late model and if the car has low miles I’d be pushing for a remanufactured engine rather than a salvage yard unit. With the latter you never know what you’re getting even if the salvage unit has very low miles…
I own a small shop and had a similar thing happen to a customer’s car. He was a regular and very fastidious about his upkeep, oil change every 3000. He purchased a new truck and I had just done his third oil change at 9000. He called me a while after the oil change, maybe a month and said his truck had quit running. I went to where the truck had quit and the oil filter was gone and the motor about 90% locked up. I put oil in it, it took all seven quarts in an F150. I looked at the odometer and he had put about 2500 miles on it since his last oil change. The first thing I did was go looking for the missing oil filter, did find it where there was a large oil spill on the road. Took a while as it was a country road with ditches on both sides of the road. It was a Carquest filter which is made by Wix so it was not a cheap filter. I bagged it and took it back to the shop and measured it with calipers, it had swelled in length and girth before blowing it off the motor, pulled the threads right out of it. Carquest said the oil pressure relief valve had stuck in the truck and built enough pressure to blow the filter off, unusual but it can happen. The Ford dealer where he bought it said the relief valve was working when he took it in to them after the incident. It ended up costing him about $6000 for a new engine installed. I had my butt covered because I recovered the missing filter. Strange things can happen.
@rustfetish One could only assume you put a new oil filter in before adding the oil while on the road, but missing that point makes me curious. A bud double gasketeted the oil filter in his boat, blow out and oil everywhere but warning light and timely turn of of engine, no issues. No oil light and you feel vindicated the guy got stuck for 6k?
I’m still not buying the burst filter by the OP’s shop or the stuck relief valve statements.
@rustfetish I tend to think that filter blew off because of poorly cut threads (maybe due to worn tooling during manufacturing or whatever) or from the filter being overtightened. Did you personally change the oil or was it done by someone else?
It might be interesting also to measure the thickness of the metal used in the filter construction.
I need your thoughts on this, please: Toyota said that the short block was destroyed because of the extreme heat it was exposed due to no oil in the engine - there were shavings on the oil pan; there was some warping from metal rubbing against metal. The mechanic shop does not want to use their liability insurance. I was hoping he would, so instead of an engine I would get the check and use the money for a down payment on an used car. I don’t believe that fixing the engine is going to be a good solution. I have this gut feeling that something is still going to happen to this engine further down the road as a result of this mechanic’s negligence. The mechanic shop does not want for Toyota to fix the engine, they want to do the job themselves so they can save money and not use their liability insurance (it’s all about them, not me). They said they would give me a 1 year warranty. However, I don’t trust them but I have no alternative. Taking them to court would be a lengthy process and I still would not have a car or an engine. I am thinking about letting these guys fix my car and trading it in. I am not happy about this because I was looking to use my car for another 6 to 8 years. It now has about 100k miles. Now I have to spend money I don’t have and still get an used car than hopefully will be good. What advise do you have for me? The shop still claims that the oil filter burst (I don’t care about it at this point). I am literally getting the short end of the stick.
I know what I would do. I’d tell them a replacement low miles engine to be installed by the Toyota dealer or take them to small claims court.
Why allow the people who butchered your engine be the ones to allegedly fix it? That could lead to throwing a worn out, oil burning, rattling engine in there, running it out the door, and then waving goodbye to you while claiming any problems were not caused by them.
They can claim filter burst if they want but it doesn’t matter. If the filter did burst they’re the ones responsible to make you whole. It’s their responsibility to go after the filter manufacturer.
If the burst filter doesn’t exist anymore then it’s still all BS.
Why should you get the short end of the stick? Sorry if I come across as a bit harsh but my principles can be somewhat firm and I’ve been known to figuratively shoot myself in one foot to make a point with the other even if it costs me physically or financially.
“The mechanic shop does not want to use their liability insurance.”
This fiasco is the exact reason that shops have liability insurance . . .
“they want to do the job themselves”
Uh huh . . . they’re the guys who most likely botched it in the first place
“I was looking to use my car for another 6 to 8 years”
If you let these guys “fix” your car, you can forget about 6-8 years of use
In all honesty, I think Rod Knox had an excellent idea. This is always an option, but it’s probably not used very often, for various reasons. If they buy the car off you, then you’re compensated, to a degree, anyways. You won’t have to deal with them anymore, and vice versa. And for all you care, they can “fix” the car when they have a slow day, then advertise it for sale to some unsuspecting person, as a prime condition car
If this is a full service shop with experience in rebuilding engines, I would let them do it, but ask for a longer warrantee. A good compromise would be that they give you a 4 to 5 year warrantee and you will agree to let them do all the oil changes on an agreed upon schedule so that they can see that they are being done on time.
I can’t understand letting them replace the engine. I’d fear that they took every shortcut and butchered this job like they did the oil change.
Because you are out a car, I’d find out from the dealer what price you should seek, and you could also search Craigs list to decide what a fair price is for your car.
Then top that number with a few hundred for your troubles, registration of another car, etc. and then make them an offer to buy your car. Remember though, they will try to counter offer at a lower amount, just like selling to anyone else. So be sure to add a little bargaining room also.
Hopefully they will take your offer and you can walk right over to the dealer and make a purchase.
If the car is still at the dealers…let the oil change place have it towed after they own it. Until they do, I wouldn’t let them near it.
If a surgeon botched a knee operation and left me crippled I doubt very seriously that I’d give him a shot at correcting his mistake on that either.
No matter what route you take on this I certainly don’t think that you should just accept what has happened as a cruel twist of fate and resign yourself to being up the creek without a paddle.
They’re an established shop; pay a lawyer a 100 bucks to send them a firm letter laying out any options you prefer to settle this matter and be done with it.
There’s no way the shop wants to end up in any court over something like this and if pushed into a corner they will likely figure that paying for a decent used engine installation is more economically viable for them.
I don’t have a super good feeling about it, but I think the method most likely to get the OP satisfaction is to have the same shop install a used replacement engine. Corollas are very numerous and they get in wrecks like any other car, so finding a used replacement engine shouldn’t be that difficult. If the shop wants to charge something extra to do it this way, try to make a deal w/them so it works for you and for them.
I wouldn’t allow them to try to rebuild your existing engine. But part of the deal might be that they keep your engine, and can rebuild and sell it if they want to recoup some of the cost.
I’m not sure if it has been determined what exactly caused the problem, but sometimes oil filters can get installed incorrectly. That’d be my guess.
As mentioned above, for the future, it’s always a good idea to check the work that you paid to have done for you – i.e. check the dipstick – before leaving the shop. And again once you reach your destination.
In addition to what everyone else said, I think whether the filter burst, came off, etc. is relevant whether the OP wants to pursue it or not. If the filter burst, it was more of an “accident”, for which the shop may be liable, but could be blamed on a bad part as well. (whether or not its true) If they forgot to put in oil, that’s pure negligence, plain and simple, and is 100% on them.
Thank you so much for all your thoughtful suggestions. These guy just wants to put in an old used engine. he said that repairing my engine using original Toyota parts was going to be too expensive and too much time. In addition, he wants to give me a 2004 car that he owns and fixed to try and sell. I am not going to go for that. He did not even want to sign a letter that I prepared where I listed what we were going to do. I am going to try to use my car insurance. I opened a claim and I am waiting for the adjuster to call me today. I have a 1k deductible, if they say they can help me. I will then look to take them to small claims court to recover some of my losses. It’s going to be along journey. I trust that, since I am a victim of this unfortunate event, that God will help me with this one. I have a 5 year old and I need a car, and a safe one for that matter.
@ok4450 and @Barkydog…I did install a new filter on it, Carquest 85372 which is manufactured by Wix. My parts come from a local Carquest where I am. I know about the stacking of filter gaskets so yes, there was no old gasket on it when I did the oil change and when I reinstalled the filter along the hiway. This is a very easy filter to get to also as it sits right on the lower drivers side front of the motor. The owner basically drove until the motor stalled out, approximately 4 miles at 55 to 65 mph. I found the oil slick about 4 miles back from where the truck quit along with the old oil filter after much searching because I felt it was a key to what happened. I personally did the oil change @ok4450. I gave the filter to my Carquest dealer and he gave me a sheet from Wix filters that explained “Filter Ballooning” as they called it and also the only thing that would cause it would be the pressure relief valve sticking. They said it would cause an instant peak in pressure at hiway speeds that would result in what happened to the filter. I tend to agree with you @ok4450, poorly cut threads. It was not cross-threaded nor overtightened as my hands were the only ones that touched it. I feel everything I did was by the book and with quality parts @Barkydog. And yes this man and his wife still brought their vehicles to me after this.
@Barkydog and @ok4450…I just did a quick search for some pressure possibilities on an unregulated gear type oil pump and it is capable of a little over 3000 psi. depending on viscosity, speed and supply. A far cry from the 30 to 60 psi. autos are designed for. Knowledge never hurts.
rustfetish, It would take two things to cause the filter to balloon, a stuck bypass valve and a clogged/defective filter. Its hard to believe that both of these occurred at the same time. I have seen bypass valves stick before, but never in the closed position. I have seen them stick only in the open position. But that all doesn’t really matter, this happened on your watch and you are responsible for the damages.
Athena FL, would you ask the Toyota dealer if there was evidence of a stuck bypass valve. If so, was it stuck open or closed? Just for curiosity on my part.
