I’m sure it will be economical, but it won’t be anywhere near $100/barrel. There will be plenty of other sources as the price increases. We are not running out of oil, but we may be running out of cheap oil.
On the news the other night, it was reported that gasoline consumption went “down” in the US the last 1/4. That’s as strong a statement as can be made.
A time in our history when the price of oil is driven as much by our national debt/ trade deficit and devaluation of the dollar. Right now it’s as much of a political issue as “supply and demand”, the over used phrase to accept the state we are in as out of our control.
The US is out of money and in debt. and the oil producers are thinking seriously of trading in the euro instead of the dollar.
Get out you bikes and your sanpans, our banker the chinese are in control. Our only way out is sacrifice and at home technology.
Last I checked, this is America. It’s a free country that for 231 years has based its economy on a free market. Our founding fathers would roll over in their graves if they saw the leaders of today who’ve taken over their roles. It is NOT the federal government’s role to tax with the objective of influencing behavior. The free market will drive behavior- if gas becomes too expensive due to normal supply and demand issues, alternatives will become more viable. I just saw that Americans used almost 4% less gas in a recent month vs the same month a year ago! Good news! So quit trying to play with the taxes (except to get rid of them) and let the market do it’s thing. And it always does and it always does it when the people are ready, never before.
Oil shale may be very close now. I recall reading (US News and World Report) about more expensive sources in Wyoming becoming economically attractive at around $100 per barrel. It may have been oil sands, but it was still a large reservoir not used until now due to high extraction costs. And even if it is now a viable source, time is needed to start the flow to refineries.
“Last I checked, this is America. It’s a free country that for 231 years has based its economy on a free market. Our founding fathers would roll over in their graves if they saw the leaders of today who’ve taken over their roles. It is NOT the federal government’s role to tax with the objective of influencing behavior. The free market will drive behavior- if gas becomes too expensive due to normal supply and demand issues, alternatives will become more viable. I just saw that Americans used almost 4% less gas in a recent month vs the same month a year ago! Good news! So quit trying to play with the taxes (except to get rid of them) and let the market do it’s thing. And it always does and it always does it when the people are ready, never before.”
The government is definitely in the business of influencing people. That is a very large part of what it does. A completely free market would be a wild ride indeed. Look at the crazy markets we have had in finance, stocks and energy in the last decade. And that was not a completely free market. A free market would have no Securities and Exchange Commission to ensure that businesses tell the truth in financial reporting. Even with the SEC lying is rampant. It was so bad that the Sarbanes-Oxley Act was passed to force corporate attorneys to rat-out on their employers or go to jail. Do you want to live in a world where corporate lying is worse than it is now?
I do not want the Feds in every corner of the business market, but they do need to protect us from excessive corporate greed. Not all corporate greed; it’s what makes the world go around. We’ll never have just the right amount of interference because no one knows what the right amount is. Influencing people to reduce fuel usage is appropriate to reduce the effects of a populace ignoring the ever-nearing and ominous effects of a huge trade deficit. We see it now with dollar devaluation and without some action by someone it could spiral out of control. Are you interested in double-digit inflation? You should be - it’s coming soon without some kind of action.
If we are going to waste our time and money, why don’t we come up with a form of transportation that does’nt depend on centry old technology that pollutes the world and put all the money into the hands of the oil companies and the other terrorist. We need to start from scratch.
This thing is still going ?
Why not vent your frustrations by a little communial tree hugging ot something, in the meantime take your new gas tax, bore it, stroke it and jam it.
That will work great, if the oil monopoly wasnt artificially raising prices already. Just a reminder, some of us do make a valuable contribution to the economy but our job / business requires burning fuel.
Why shouldd my money go into your pocket because you decided to sit at home.
I’d love it if the US gov’t imposed a fuel tax similar to that the Europeans see (more than $2/gal), and then refunded 90% of that revenue back so that we each got an equal share (the other 10% would go towards developing and maintaining a mass transit infrastructure). So, if someone wanted to drive a 10 MPG Hummer they could, and if someone driving a 35 MPG Fit they could… but I bet we’d see a lot more people opting for smaller cars (or riding buses, carpooling, and walking!), and they’d make money from their refunded taxes. (I’d take my share and build the sunroom I’ve been dreaming about for 20 years!)
The first politician who suggests this tax gets my vote (and campaign contribution)!
PS I live in NY, and for the past week everyone’s been talking about the stupid thing our governor did. I am saddened however that most CITIZENS are unwilling and/or unable to have a similarly productive discussion of IMPORTANT issues (such as energy policy, health care, campaign reform, tax structure, etc.). I think this is a two pronged problem - 1) most people are not interested in these topics, 2) our educational system does not enable people to adequately inform themselves on these topics. I believe strongly that as citizens we have rights and, just as important, we have RESPONSIBILITIES, and informed and engaged citizenship is such a responsibility! Come on people… get on the ball - read the whole newspaper (not just the comics), take a class on government, get involved… PLEASE!!!
“the other 10% would go towards developing and maintaining a mass transit infrastructure”
I think the entire amount and then some would be needed for mass transit infrastructure. It seems to me that bookkeeping for such a transfer would be quite costly, too.
“I am saddened however that most CITIZENS are unwilling and/or unable to have a similarly productive discussion of IMPORTANT issues (such as energy policy, health care, campaign reform, tax structure, etc.). I think this is a two pronged problem - 1) most people are not interested in these topics, 2) our educational system does not enable people to adequately inform themselves on these topics. I believe strongly that as citizens we have rights and, just as important, we have RESPONSIBILITIES, and informed and engaged citizenship is such a responsibility! Come on people… get on the ball - read the whole newspaper (not just the comics), take a class on government, get involved… PLEASE!!!”
I’m with you, friend. If we do nothing we get what we asked for - nothing. I am going to email my two senators and my congressmen to request that they introduce legislation that will expand the gas guzzler tax to all vehicles. The ones that need it most are the large SUVs and 2.5-ton pickups that are often personal transportation, not work trucks. And many of the work trucks are purchased for vanity rather than need. Many tradesmen don’t need even the 1-ton pickup, but it isn’t manly to buy the compact trucks. I know a welder that drives a 3500 Silverado. He doesn’t carry his welding rig in the truck. His company owns the equipment and carries it there. He just wants a great, big, manly truck to drive around in. It seems to me that we should influence people to drive more fuel efficient cars if we are going to increase the CAFE to 36 MPG.
Last I checked, this is America. It’s a free country that for 231 years has based its economy on a free market.
In general that is right, but as has been found a number of times and has been legislated for, when the number of buyers or sellers gets too small it is no longer a free market. This was true of telephones some years ago, but today technology changed the playing field and it is not almost a free market. Oil certain is not a free market. While it is not a monopoly, it certainly is an oligopoly and needs special government oversight.
“I am going to email my two senators and my congressmen to request that they introduce legislation that will expand the gas guzzler tax to all vehicles.”
Right on…
I don’t think people get how important their comunication with their US senators and congressmen of their state is.
That a US Rep. votes or supports something on the west coast that disagrees with how you feel on the East, is entirely dependent on his constituents and his re election.
You can’t get upset at a Rep from Texas for supporting “big oil”. Every geographic is different…you have to pressure those that are reponsible to you, not someone else.
WE ALL HAVE LOCAL CLOUT…use it.
California could be ALL ELECTRIC…Texas, diesel etc. It’s local, not one size fits all but a mutiple solution problem and federal support for local differences.
Well, I was going to write “the other 50% would go towards developing and maintaining a mass transit infrastructure”, but I didn’t want to seem too radical. 
FWIW, here’s some info I wrote elsewhere on this site. Feel free to send it to your senators and congressmen!
Thanks,
PO
- Ethanol is a dead end. It is expensive to produce, and doesn’t have a high enough energy density. If we were serious about biofuels, we’d use biodiesel and/or butanol (butanol has an energy density close to gasoline, and is hydrophobic so it is removed off the top of the fermenter, not distilled out like ethanol, so it’s cheaper/easier to make)… and we’d make it from cellulose, not food!
- Did you know that 30% of the US corn crop is being used to make ethanol to meet 7% of our fuel needs… yup, if we used ALL of our corn we’d still be short by more than 75% (and starve)!
- Did you know that for what we are spending EACH DAY in Iraq we could remove 1 million homes from the ‘fossil fuel grid’ and provide them with energy from 100% renewable sources (wind, solar, etc.)? That’s right, for what we spend during 6 months in Iraq, we could take ALL the homes in the US off the fossil fuel grid. NOW that’s homeland security!
- If we were to take one year’s worth of Iraq money and put it into development of renewable electricity, there would be such a surplus of electricity that it’d be SO cheap that we’d be nuts not to be driving plug-in hybrids!
- Did you know that the US gov’t funds the “National Renewable Energy Laboratory” (NREL)… and that Bush has drastically cut their funding?! (Do I need to point out that he comes from oil money?)
- Did you know that wind turbines are so quiet that most people who oppose them have never actually been close to one. Those people who live near turbines will tell you that when it’s windy you hear the wind, NOT the turbines!
- Did you know that research has shown that each wind turbine is responsible for killing ~1 bird/year… yes ONLY ONE! Thousands of times more are are killed by the pollution generated by fossil fuel electric plants, pet cats, glass windows, and cars.
- Did you know that there are school districts and communities that are erecting wind turbines and selling the electricity… and it drives their taxes WAY DOWN!
- I want wind and solar electricity!
Bring our soldiers home, let the Middle East fight amongst themselves and keep their darn oil.
PS Last year I switched my electrical supply to ‘Community Wind’. My rates went up slightly, but by installing CFL my usage dropped so much that my bill went way down (so much so that the electric company sent someone to check my meter because they thought it was broken!).
Have some common sense. This is the USA. If our government outlaws vehicle ownership, we will effect 1/5th of all households in America. Also if we create road blocks for the local industry, the Europeans and Japanese will be more than glad to supply the nicotene. Notice the motortrend truck of the year is the “Toyota Tundra”. Even porsche has jumped in the game with the Cayane @ 6-8 MPG . Education is the more difficult and more effective way to raise awareness and create social responsibility.
If you want to raise awareness about the trucks and SUVs raise some money and run an ad campaign. Show how they are clumsy to drive, difficult to park and dont have to pass the same safety inspections like the other vehicles on the road. Show how they put other vehicles and pedestrians at risk by the poor visibility and high road clearence. And how 90% are used to compensate for the “tool”.
But if someone wants to pass a law, by God I am going out and buying the biggest truck I can afford just to shove a thumb in their nose. Buy them up now before the evil empire takes them away from us.
Freedom is the right to choose. It could be the right thing or the wrong thing but the operative word here is “freedom”.
Did you see the article (“Move Over, Oil, There?s Money in Texas Wind”) in the New York Times (23 Feb 2008) on the HUGE number of wind turbines Texas is erecting? I love this line quoting someone who is putting up wind turbines, “?That?s just money you?re hearing,? he said as they hummed in a brisk breeze recently”!!!
I’m using my local clout… I send letters and emails to my local, state, and national elected officials, teach (HS, college, and retirees) on these topics, and post on discussion boards like this one. In my experience, the more people learn about these topics, the more they’re astounded that we’re not doing more!!!
Thanks,
PO
“Also if we create road blocks for the local industry, the Europeans and Japanese will be more than glad to supply the nicotene.”
What’s a “nicotene” and where can I get one before they are outlawed?
"Last I checked, this is America. It’s a free country that for 231 years has based its economy on a free market.
If you think the oil company is a free market you need a reality check. When you have so few companies with a extremely LARGE and captive audience…it’s IMPOSSIBLE to have a completely free market.
Meant to be a reference to our addiction to “huge” vehicles. May have missed the spelling completely.
As far as the availability Toyota showroom is a good place to start. You can also visit Ford, Dodge, Porsche (just cuz of the stupid suv, love their other offerings though) and GM.
Why not drill for more oil and build some refineries. We may use most of the energy but we also produce most of the goods and services. Sounds like a fair tradeoff to me. Taxes only slow or stop the economy. If you want to live like a third world country , just slow the economy and your wish will come true. Redistributing taxes is like giving yourself a transfusion from one arm to the other and spilling 90% of the blood in the process. After awhile you run out.