# Modern safety features encourage sloppy driving in the youth. Discuss **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [October 14, 2018, 3:29am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726 "2018-10-14T03:29:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![BillRussell](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/billrussell/32/3179_2.png) [@BillRussell](https://community.cartalk.com/u/BillRussell)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 1:24am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/21 "2018-10-17T01:24:30Z")
huh? why would anyone put telephone wire in a car? I think you are confused with some other wire or feature. Telephone wire is a cable with 4 small size wires, typically used to run old type telephone connections inside walls. It is not suitable for a car as it can’t handle flexing or vibration or temperature extremes. And voltmeters detect voltage, ammeters detect current. ---
**Author:** ![ArlHtsMelissa](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/arlhtsmelissa/32/22867_2.png) [@ArlHtsMelissa](https://community.cartalk.com/u/ArlHtsMelissa)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 3:13pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/22 "2018-10-17T15:13:33Z")
Are you saying, if there was telephone wire in autos then you would use an ammeter to detect current? ---
**Author:** ![VOLVO-V70](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/8e8cbc/32.png) [@VOLVO-V70](https://community.cartalk.com/u/VOLVO-V70)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 3:31pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/23 "2018-10-17T15:31:18Z")
Melissa , what is the deal ? There is not any telephone wire in vehicle’s and there is not going to be . And why do you care anyway. ---
**Author:** ![ArlHtsMelissa](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/arlhtsmelissa/32/22867_2.png) [@ArlHtsMelissa](https://community.cartalk.com/u/ArlHtsMelissa)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 3:36pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/24 "2018-10-17T15:36:54Z")
Before I answer that, what is the deal with “The Tappet Brothers.” –I am looking for untapped energy. ---
**Author:** ![Mustangman](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/mustangman/32/44130_2.png) [@Mustangman](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Mustangman)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 3:38pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/25 "2018-10-17T15:38:45Z")
There are already communication buses in cars. Digital communication paths from electronic control to electronic control. Not “telephone phone wire” These communication buses are monitored by every ECU they are attached to. If the communication fails, they all know this and a check engine light will come on and maybe flash on your dash. The signal is a digital voltage based signal. Read up on it here: > **[CAN bus](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAN_bus)** > > A Controller Area Network (CAN bus) is a robust vehicle bus standard designed to allow microcontrollers and devices to communicate with each other in applications without a host computer. It is a message-based protocol, designed originally for multiplex electrical wiring within automobiles to save on copper, but is also used in many other contexts. > Development of the CAN bus started in 1983 at Robert Bosch GmbH. The protocol was officially released in 1986 at the Society of Automotive Engineers... ---
**Author:** ![Mustangman](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/mustangman/32/44130_2.png) [@Mustangman](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Mustangman)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 3:40pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/26 "2018-10-17T15:40:12Z")
Tappets are the valve lifters in an engine. Older cars required frequent adjustment to keep the car running properly. When the brothers started the CarTalk radio show, they called themselves the “Tappet Brothers” ---
**Author:** ![ArlHtsMelissa](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/arlhtsmelissa/32/22867_2.png) [@ArlHtsMelissa](https://community.cartalk.com/u/ArlHtsMelissa)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 4:03pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/27 "2018-10-17T16:03:30Z")
So, you would use an ammeter to detect current in telephone wire? ---
**Author:** ![Mustangman](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/mustangman/32/44130_2.png) [@Mustangman](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Mustangman)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 4:09pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/28 "2018-10-17T16:09:15Z")
Yes, ammeters would detect current in a phone wire ---
**Author:** ![BillRussell](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/billrussell/32/3179_2.png) [@BillRussell](https://community.cartalk.com/u/BillRussell)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 4:27pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/29 "2018-10-17T16:27:05Z")
I suspect Melissa is trolling us. Meaningless statements to elicit a response, which is the definition of troll. ---
**Author:** ![VOLVO-V70](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/8e8cbc/32.png) [@VOLVO-V70](https://community.cartalk.com/u/VOLVO-V70)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 4:43pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/30 "2018-10-17T16:43:27Z")
> [@BillRussell](#): > > I suspect Melissa is trolling us Again………… ---
**Author:** ![ArlHtsMelissa](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/arlhtsmelissa/32/22867_2.png) [@ArlHtsMelissa](https://community.cartalk.com/u/ArlHtsMelissa)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 4:48pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/31 "2018-10-17T16:48:27Z")
The CAN bus information and ammeter information is informative. ---
**Author:** ![shadowfax](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/shadowfax/32/13026_2.png) [@shadowfax](https://community.cartalk.com/u/shadowfax)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 5:03pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/32 "2018-10-17T17:03:23Z")
> [@ArlHtsMelissa](#): > > Before I answer that, what is the deal with “The Tappet Brothers.” > > –I am looking for untapped energy. Are you alright? Your posts in this thread lean toward the bizarre. Do you need an adult? ---
**Author:** ![ArlHtsMelissa](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/arlhtsmelissa/32/22867_2.png) [@ArlHtsMelissa](https://community.cartalk.com/u/ArlHtsMelissa)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 5:18pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/33 "2018-10-17T17:18:47Z")
Alright, you caught me trying to ask a non-car question as a car talk question. ---
**Author:** ![BillRussell](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/billrussell/32/3179_2.png) [@BillRussell](https://community.cartalk.com/u/BillRussell)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 6:09pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/34 "2018-10-17T18:09:27Z")
Don’t feed the troll. If you never reply to the posts, they will go away. ---
**Author:** ![sgtrock21](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/sgtrock21/32/246_2.png) [@sgtrock21](https://community.cartalk.com/u/sgtrock21)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2018, 11:54pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/35 "2018-10-17T23:54:26Z")
New drivers should definitely learn the basics. As far as I know they have to pass a written test of traffic laws to obtain a learners permit. If they pass driving usually requires a over 18 years old driver with a valid driver license in the passenger seat as an instructor. They should still learn the basics of driving. Obeying traffic laws and situational awareness. Learning to drive in a vehicle with modern safety features would be OK. As long as they know the limitations. ---
**Author:** ![TwinTurbo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8baadc/32.png) [@TwinTurbo](https://community.cartalk.com/u/TwinTurbo)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2018, 8:07pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/36 "2018-10-18T20:07:51Z")
> [@sgtrock21](#): > > As long as they know the limitations But you don’t really know the limitations unless you exceed them 🙂 We used to do this in empty parking lots or abandoned sand pits etc ---
**Author:** ![shadowfax](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/shadowfax/32/13026_2.png) [@shadowfax](https://community.cartalk.com/u/shadowfax)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2018, 9:42pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/37 "2018-10-18T21:42:36Z")
> [@TwinTurbo](#): > > But you don’t really know the limitations unless you exceed them 🙂 > We used to do this in empty parking lots or abandoned sand pits etc For years I have advocated making autocross part of driver’s ed. Great way to learn what cars do at their handling limits without exceeding 40mph even on a fast course. Learn to autocross well, and control the inevitable slides/over/understeer and you’re also learning how to control the car while swerving to avoid the truck that just pulled out in front of you. You’re even learning to drive in the snow because you know what the car does when the back end breaks loose, and you know how to correct for it. ---
**Author:** ![Rod-Knox](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a183cd/32.png) [@Rod-Knox](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Rod-Knox)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2018, 10:56pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/38 "2018-10-18T22:56:22Z")
I feel like I was lucky to have learned to drive more or less on my own in cars, trucks and farm tractors back in the good ole days. Mistakes usually resulted in being chewed out but no one was ever badly injured and the dings were overlooked as a part of normal operation. ---
**Author:** ![sgtrock21](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/sgtrock21/32/246_2.png) [@sgtrock21](https://community.cartalk.com/u/sgtrock21)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2018, 12:47am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/39 "2018-10-19T00:47:10Z")
Of course we did. Do parents teaching their children to drive still do that? Do current parents actually know how to drive? I was taught to drive by my Father who had never had a traffic citation in an old 1954 Chevrolet 3 speed M/T column shift at the age of 13 on our dead end gravel street. There were no large empty parking lots. I was taught skid recovery on gravel rural roads. I taught my 2 Sons to drive in my 1973 Ford Mustang 250 cu in I6 3 speed M/T floor shift with limitations training in large parking lots. It included rain, snow, and ice. Also using the lever hand brake starts on moderate inclines. Their final test was using the hand brake on a steep hill. They both passed it easily. My opinion is that todays fledgling drivers should be first taught the basics then the safety features with emphasis on their limitations. ---
**Author:** ![sgtrock21](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/sgtrock21/32/246_2.png) [@sgtrock21](https://community.cartalk.com/u/sgtrock21)\ **Post date:** [October 19, 2018, 1:23am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726/40 "2018-10-19T01:23:53Z")
In 1966 at the age of 13 to14 I was paid $1 per hour (righteous bucks) to drive old military surplus Jeeps towing irrigation pipe trailers. A few friends chose Jeep CJ5s as their first cars. I chose a very nice condition 1963 Pontiac Bonneville convertible. 421 cu in tri power 380 hp, 4speed Hydra-Matic with bucket seats and floor shifter. $900. The perfect car for a 15 year old! Safety features? Absolutely none. My parents said I could buy any car as long as I paid for it and supported it. They were people of their word but I am sure regretted that! I later suffered driving M151 military Jeeps. I did not own a Jeep until I bought a new 1991 Laredo. Much more civilized. [Previous page](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726.md?page=1) [Next page](https://community.cartalk.com/t/modern-safety-features-encourage-sloppy-driving-in-the-youth-discuss/126726.md?page=3)