The most cost effective fuel choice today is natural gas. The Ford F150 is very popular in that version. Fuel is 64 cents a gallon in Utah and 90 cents in oklahoma. I have the Honda GX and pay $2.00 in Los Angeles. He could sell that truck for a premium in Utah. Amazing you guys do not promote a safe, cheap fuel source that is produced in the USA. Every CNG pump is part of the future hydrogen infrastructure. We have the capability to produce our own fuel and when we use it we have the cleanest burning vehicles on the road, instead ethanol is selected and and food prices go through the roof. Your bias with the re-entry vehicle comment is apparent. Take the time to go to Cngchat.com and learn about practical technology whose fuel does not send a dime to the oil producers who care little about us. Alan
When the subject matter involves fossil fuels as an energy source, those who have the ear of the public bear an obligation to make very clear the distinctions between natural gas (and CNG), liquified natural gas (LNG) and propane (LPG). The fossil fuel industry has no interest making this clarification, as their mission is to sell natural gas and therefore increase the demand for imported natural gas in the form of LNG. LNG is highly controversial in many coastal communities for a long list of reasons. These include the intrusion on local waterways by huge tankers loaded with liquified methane and the impact this would certainly have on traditional marine activities such as fishing. Specialized LNG terminals need to be constructed to regassify the LNG for distribution through pipelines which have yet to be built in most instances. These ships are considered to be terrorist targets and subject to exclusionary zones of 2 miles or more enforced by marine patrol vessels. Despite data that demonstrate a narrow range of fuel/air concentration to achieve ingition, nobody disputes the fact that each of these ships contains the energy equivalent of multiple Hiroshima-size nuclear bombs. Once ignition occurs there is no practical way to extinguish an LNG fire.
Natural gas (mostly CH4) is not the stuff in your gas grill (C3H8) that can sit in liquid form at low pressure at ordinary temperatures in thin steel bottles. Natural gas may become the transitional energy source for the next few decades for transportation purposes, but it is not free of controversy or environmental impact.
Jim in Midcoast Maine
As weird as it is to be listening from Colombia, this CNG theme fits me like a glove…
Here in Colombia CNG conversions are very popular, CNG filling stations are rather popular and easy to find. (http://www.gazel.com) The conversion isn’t a terribly expensive process (around U$1500) and usually pays for itself in around a year.
In my personal experience, I own a 1994 Nissan Pathfinder which I’ve had converted to run on Compressed Natural Gas. I can still use both CNG and gasoline, but CNG is alot cheaper to run on than gasoline. Ever since I did the conversion, I’m spending around a third of what I was spending on fuel bills. The down side is that my range is lower than on gasoline, unless I decide to waste ALL of my trunk space on another fuel tank.
Along with the conversion the government hs established certain safety procedures so that people dont drive around with exploding gas tanks. Your car is chipped with a tag that registers the last time you had your annual check up, if it’s been longer thatn a year, the filling station can’t sell you fuel. every five years you MUST change to new gas tanks to avoid metal fatigue (due to compression and decompression of normal use). On the whole, I’ve never heard of any incidents involving tanks blowing up or anything. Besides, according to regulations, fuel tanks can only be installed in such a manner that they aren’t exposed to the road , and are within the confines of the car’s structure (no installing tanks on roof racks).
I’ve been driving my CNG pathfinder for 3 years now and I’m very happy with it.
WE have a Discussion on CNG over at ECOMODDER One owner states the Following
"Las Vegas Civic GX
Hi there. I live in Las Vegas and bought a Civic GX last October. The local dealers do not carry them but they were able to have one transported here, and they can service them should it be necessary. It is also possible to have a Phill installed (I did).
My impression of it so far:
The GX drives and performs like a regular Civic as far as I can tell. Supposedly it has about 10% less horsepower than other Civics but as I am coming down from a 400 hp Cadillac (it was nice, but 12 mpg was unacceptable) I can’t tell. I get around 32-37 mpg depending on how vigilant I am with my driving habits. It has about a 200 - 220 mile range. Half the trunk is taken up by the tank, but I use it for commuting so that is no big deal, I could probably fit one set of golf clubs in the space, max.
As far as refueling in Las Vegas:
There are local stations where you can fill up around town (about 4 or 5) for $1.60 to 1.70 per gallon equivalent. With the Phill unit at home it costs about 1.30 to 1.50 from what I can calculate. Southwest Gas will charge you a lower rate for the gas used for your car. The local stations will fill up your tank in a few minutes, the Phill takes about 12-14 hours for an empty tank.
You can get a $4000 tax credit for the car and $1000 credit for the Phill, this money comes directly off what you owe in taxes but will not take you above 0 (so if you owe $500 it will knock that out, but they won’t then give you $3500 on your refund).
As far as I can tell I am probably the first in Vegas with a Phill unit (given the amount of confusion on the part of people I dealt with trying to get it installed), so if you are interested in getting a GX &/or the Phill drop me a line and I can give you the right phone numbers to call and hopefully help smooth out the process (I don’t have any financial incentive for this, just hopefully can help others avoid the headaches I had with this process)."
I have a 2006 Civic GX with +60,000 miles. I get 30-40 mpg and have a Phill station at home. It
costs about $1.50 per GGE (factoring in the installation costs, electricity, etc.) Compare this
to $3.75/gal for gasoline. At local CNG filling stations, I have paid recently from 1.79/GGE to
2.85/GGE. Also, the HOV stickers get me in the carpool lanes even when driving solo. When I
installed the Phill, the gas company switched me to a lower rate schedule. In fact, my mechanic
bought one when he heard about mine. Even with the CNG used by his car, his household heating
bill actually dropped, due to the lower rates.
Hey Joe, Until my recent retirement, the last five years I worked for a local government I drove a CNG vehicle. The tank was in the bed of the truck and protected by a thick plastic liner. Once a year during a regularly scheduled PM, the mechanics would check the integrity of the tank. My observations in five years of driving this F-150 are: 1) The gas is easy to fill but a full tank of CNG is not the same volume as a tank of petrol, and didn’t last as long. This wasn’t too much of a problem unless one had to travel quite a bit which results in more frequent fill ups. The CNG pumps are fewer and far in between as well. 2) The truck ran fine on the CNG and in comparison with my personal F-150 which runs on unleaded regular, it seemed to me the CNG truck ran much cleaner as I noticed whenever checking the oil the CNG truck’s oil never got as dark as my own truck, which is a year newer and has less mileage. The gas burner’s oil gets dark between oil changes and the CNG truck’s oil always looked like new oil. 3) The price was comparable to what the city fleet paid for bulk gas too, which is cheaper than we get it for. I can’t remember there ever being a case of a CNG vehicle exploding as opposed to the gas fueled Crown Vic police car which did when rear ended by an out of control taxi.
Tom and Ray,
Come on you two and do a revisit on this caller. I own a 2007 Honda Civic GX (CNG only version) and I get 40 mpg on the highway, pay 63 CENTS per gasoline gallon equivalent, and this car is the CLEANEST car on the planet. The tanks are super strong very thick steel. Joe should find a way to get this system tested to see if he can start saving money and provide cleaner air to his neighbors. Ford made lots of these and they are very popular in Utah due to low fuel costs and clean air concerns. CNG in most areas is a fraction of cost of gasoline, so please set the story straight.
Steve
CNG isn’t just safer, it’s better in many ways: cheaper[under $3/ gallon equivalentor galeq], 128 octane, 2 H2Os/CO2 versus 2 CO2 per H2O from gasoline, diesel and ethanol, and local production from garbage and agricultural waste. Even LNG from overseas, with all its dangers, is safer than crude oil in a single-hull ship or gasoline in tankers rolling down the road to service stations, and cheaper to distribute. Most of the pipelines are already in place. Methane doesn’t spill, it goes straight up in the air, like hydrogen. Sure, a galeq is more energetic than petrol, but it’s a gas, not a liquid and that’s automatically safer except in a tunnel. My 1998 Ford Econoline has never had a problem. Since Methane is a BIG greenhouse gas, capturing it and using it and harvesting it from the arctic will REVERSE climate change.
Linus Hollis, ScD