# Dealing with the www **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [January 8, 2024, 6:35pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133 "2024-01-08T18:35:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![MikeInNH](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a587f6/32.png) [@MikeInNH](https://community.cartalk.com/u/MikeInNH)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2024, 9:32pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/41 "2024-01-11T21:32:03Z")
> [@TheWonderful90s](#): > > I’m not convinced that a 3rd party hosted image or such can read cookies set by the site that embeds it Some URL you visited is paid by the third party cookie owner to plant the cookie on your computer when you connect to it. ---
**Author:** ![Beancounter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/59ef9b/32.png) [@Beancounter](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Beancounter)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2024, 12:48pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/42 "2024-01-12T12:48:57Z")
Late to the discussion but the problems are 1. Most programmers have no experience actually using their software on a day to day basis often leading to unnecessary complications. 2. With the cost of storage plumeting and processing/transmission speeds greatly improving, Software Bloat has always been a problem. i.e. If I have the space and speed, the natural tendancy is to fill it even if nobody actually wants that “nifty new feature”. 3. Software development/provision has never been cheap or free so the natural tendancy is to pass the costs off to the consumer via Cookies or Consumer Data Aggrevation. 4. Finally, although it’s better than it was in the past, programmers have always been under a rush to provide “the latest and greatest” leading to less than perfect quality control and less than optimal consumer acceptance. The old joke was, “Alpha testing is if the software compiles and Beta testing is the calls to our Help Desk”. Taking the same approach to new software that I take to new vehicles, my solution is to whenever possible, to defer installation of upgrades for a year to “allow the other suckers time to weed out the problems” and use a Blocker to to control Cookies. ---
**Author:** ![VDCdriver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/vdcdriver/32/48514_2.png) [@VDCdriver](https://community.cartalk.com/u/VDCdriver)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2024, 1:52pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/43 "2024-01-12T13:52:55Z")
> [@George\_San\_Jose1](#): > > the management decided to require the patrons to use a cell phone to obtain certain of their weekly sale-price items. For several years, the dominant supermarket chain in my area has featured “digital coupons” that you load to your shopper’s card via the internet. However, sometimes their website works, and sometimes it doesn’t. Last week, I noticed that their weekly flyer had “physical” coupons that one could clip and scan at the checkout if you didn’t want to go “digital”. I think that they got a lot of complaints about their wonky website, and that resulted in a return to a paper alternative. ---
**Author:** ![oldtimer-11](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/e79b87/32.png) [@oldtimer-11](https://community.cartalk.com/u/oldtimer-11)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2024, 1:54pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/44 "2024-01-12T13:54:02Z")
I order a lot of my groceries and other goods from Walmart pickup. I have a cell phone but they are so used to everyone using the app that theu seldom answer my call. I go lust inside the store entrance and just tell one of the returning workers my name and slot numberr and they bring my order out next, ahead of people who have been waiting. I hate shopping in stores, I can never find anything. My wife did all our shopping unless it was an auto parts, hardware or limber store… I only have text and phone service on my cell phone and it costs me $69 a year including a new phone amd all the new phoms are larger and harder to get in my pocket so I transfer the 1500 minutes and year’s more expensive service . ---
**Author:** ![VDCdriver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/vdcdriver/32/48514_2.png) [@VDCdriver](https://community.cartalk.com/u/VDCdriver)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2024, 1:55pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/45 "2024-01-12T13:55:08Z")
> [@George\_San\_Jose1](#): > > Do any of you folks refill your ink-jet printer’s cartridges? In my area, there were a few shops whose only business was the refilling of printer cartridges. I guess that they weren’t very popular because they have all been closed for more than 3 years. ---
**Author:** ![MikeInNH](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a587f6/32.png) [@MikeInNH](https://community.cartalk.com/u/MikeInNH)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2024, 3:25pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/46 "2024-01-12T15:25:54Z")
> [@Beancounter](#): > > Finally, although it’s better than it was in the past, programmers have always been under a rush to provide “the latest and greatest” leading to less than perfect quality control and less than optimal consumer acceptance I don’t know what kind of companies you’ve worked for…but that is NOT the case in most software jobs I’ve had and certainly NOT how I run my shop. Agile development has been around for decades now. You should look into it. Yes there’s always pressure from upper management to get the software out quickly, but a good manager knows there’s a cost to that. True Agile software development management and developers agree to a date based on the requirements. If there’s injection then either the date will slip, or features will be dropped. ---
**Author:** ![TwinTurbo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8baadc/32.png) [@TwinTurbo](https://community.cartalk.com/u/TwinTurbo)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2024, 4:51pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/47 "2024-01-12T16:51:32Z")
> [@Beancounter](#): > > The old joke was, “Alpha testing is if the software compiles and Beta testing is the calls to our Help Desk”. This has always been funny (to softheads anyway). My experience and expertise is more real-time embedded software development (some places like to call it firmware but I digress). We had a guy we used to joke about back in the day. We called his approach the {guy’s last name} level 7 verification and validation approach to development: 1. If I enter code text, it will compile 2. If it compiles, it will assemble 3. If it assembles, it will link 4. If it links, it will load 5. If it loads, it will run 6. If it runs, it is good 7. If it’s good, no additional verification needed! So, just entering your coding text is enough to produce good product! If this was software talk, I could go on regarding bloatware we see today but leave that for another day… ---
**Author:** ![bing](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/bing/32/4619_2.png) [@bing](https://community.cartalk.com/u/bing)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2024, 6:40pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/48 "2024-01-12T18:40:57Z")
I’ve been retired for enough years that I have wiped a lot of my work horrors from my memory. I refuse to allow it back in. I’ve been through a few major business software changes and my conclusion was it was the bone headed people selecting the software to make it fit, not the software itself. I have seen business come to a complete halt when the switch was thrown, unable to initiate purchases or pay for them. Months to unravel and millions wasted. We quickly sweep under the rug the dmv software changes in minnesota that rendered title, license plate, and drivers license processing unable to be done. Millions spent again trying to unravel it. ---
**Author:** ![MikeInNH](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a587f6/32.png) [@MikeInNH](https://community.cartalk.com/u/MikeInNH)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2024, 9:27pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/49 "2024-01-12T21:27:56Z")
> [@TwinTurbo](#): > > - If I enter code text, it will compile > - If it compiles, it will assemble > - If it assembles, it will link > - If it links, it will load > - If it loads, it will run > - If it runs, it is good > - If it’s good, no additional verification needed! He wouldn’t work for me for very long. Embedded systems are different. I have a couple guys that work for me - and that’s all they do. And they get paid handsomely for their work. Besides the coding and testing and “CODE REVIEWS” - there’s unit tests. No code gets added to the “Git” repository without verified unit tests. Unit testing can easily take up 30% of the overall development cycle. But it’s worth it. Especially if new functionality is added. You run all unit tests to ensure you didn’t mess up anything else - which EVERY ENGINEER has done in their career. ---
**Author:** ![George\_San\_Jose1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e5b9ba/32.png) [@George\_San\_Jose1](https://community.cartalk.com/u/George_San_Jose1)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2024, 10:40pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/50 "2024-01-12T22:40:30Z")
> [@VDCdriver](#): > > or several years, the dominant supermarket chain in my area has featured “digital coupons” that you load to your shopper’s card via the internet. However, sometimes their website works, and sometimes it doesn’t. The grocery store I mentioned above (that went out of business) didn’t allow you to use the internet, must have a smart phone at the checkout. But the other national-chain grocery store in this area offers that option to folks who don’t own smart phones. The problem is they require setting up an internet account and providing a bunch of personal info that is likely going to result in telemarking calls. If they allowed me to just use my card number, I’d probably use that method for their digital sales items w/no complaints. > [@VDCdriver](#): > > business was the refilling of printer cartridges. I guess that they weren’t very popular because they have all been closed They’re all closed here too. I have to do the cartridge refill procedure myself. It isn’t very difficult to do the actual refill, but can be a little difficult to unclog the dry ink from the cartridge’s printing channels. ---
**Author:** ![bing](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/bing/32/4619_2.png) [@bing](https://community.cartalk.com/u/bing)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2024, 11:25pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/51 "2024-01-12T23:25:55Z")
As a kid I had three convenience stores within four blocks plus a bar a half block away. One of the store was fairly modern, another was not very modern, but the third was from the turn of the century. Everything on shelves he accessed with a ladder or long grabber. You never got close to any merchandise. They are all gone now I think more due to the age of the owners than lack of modernization. ---
**Author:** ![TheWonderful90s](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/thewonderful90s/32/29584_2.png) [@TheWonderful90s](https://community.cartalk.com/u/TheWonderful90s)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2024, 3:09am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/52 "2024-01-13T03:09:54Z")
> [@bing](#): > > You never got close to any merchandise. They are all gone now I think more due to the age of the owners than lack of modernization. Now the need for that is back. ---
**Author:** ![Rod-Knox](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a183cd/32.png) [@Rod-Knox](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Rod-Knox)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2024, 9:17pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/53 "2024-01-19T21:17:02Z")
> [@Rod-Knox](#): > > More and more I find dealing with internet sites to be too frustrating to handle. I just gave up reopening my alldata account and donated the fee to their Christmas party fund. It appears that makes me one of their most profitable customers. > Looking back I recall my first dealing with Alldata was 30 years ago when they mailed me floppy discs every 90 days. when they put the system on line I happened onto cartalk which seems to also be getting complicated. It turns out that somewhere in my button pushing with Alldata I hit a good key. I just got a note that the money was refunded. Imagine that. ---
**Author:** ![bing](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/bing/32/4619_2.png) [@bing](https://community.cartalk.com/u/bing)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2024, 11:57pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/54 "2024-01-19T23:57:19Z")
My computer froze up once. I had an event to go to so when I got home I just started hitting buttons on the keyboard. Don’t know what it was but something worked. ---
**Author:** ![George\_San\_Jose1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e5b9ba/32.png) [@George\_San\_Jose1](https://community.cartalk.com/u/George_San_Jose1)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2024, 1:28am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/55 "2024-01-20T01:28:14Z")
> [@Rod-Knox](#): > > the[Alldata] money was refunded I’m glad you got the refund. What sort of problems were you experiencing w/AllData? Did the problems start after a recent website change? I heard a radio news report about a general increase noted in website aggravations ---
**Author:** ![asemaster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@asemaster](https://community.cartalk.com/u/asemaster)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2024, 1:42am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/56 "2024-01-20T01:42:38Z")
> [@Rod-Knox](#): > > It turns out that somewhere in my button pushing with Alldata I hit a good key. I just got a note that the money was refunded. Imagine that. I think it’s been some time since you closed up shop (?) but over the last decade, Alldata, Mitchell, etc. have transitioned to web-based services, including your front and back office management systems in the cloud if you used them. No more DVDs sent in the mail every quarter, the info system is live and updated constantly. That part is great. The management software, not so much. Web access and wifi is everything. The shop I was managing until 2021 was going paperless/wireless. I was behind that move and that’s the future, but if the internet/wifi goes out, might as well close up and go home for the day. No way to generate a repair order, contact a customer, or order parts. Techs can’t access their RO’s, can’t look up repair info or torque specs, many scan tools need wifi to operate. Even if something gets fixed there’s no way to close out a ticket and have the customer pay. The automotive world will come to a screeching halt without web access. ---
**Author:** ![MikeInNH](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a587f6/32.png) [@MikeInNH](https://community.cartalk.com/u/MikeInNH)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2024, 2:01am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/57 "2024-01-20T02:01:14Z")
> [@asemaster](#): > > I was behind that move and that’s the future, but if the internet/wifi goes out, might as well close up and go home for the day. How often does that happen? And if it does happen - where’s the outage? Is it local? Or at the source. If local (99% probability it is), then have backup plans. Wife and I work at home. If we lose internet access - I setup my iphone as a hot-spot and connect all our devices through the phone. We have 5G access at home. Not as fast as our home access, but fast enough. You can also always do hand orders like you did some 20+ years ago. Then when you get internet access back up - you backfill the orders. ---
**Author:** ![Barkydog](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/barkydog/32/2470_2.png) [@Barkydog](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Barkydog)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2024, 3:18am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/58 "2024-01-20T03:18:20Z")
> [@asemaster](#): > > The automotive world will come to a screeching halt without web access. True that! We had software for analysis for some company, even though the software was on the computer you could not access it without web verification. ---
**Author:** ![asemaster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@asemaster](https://community.cartalk.com/u/asemaster)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2024, 6:15pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/59 "2024-01-20T18:15:36Z")
> [@MikeInNH](#): > > How often does that happen? Not often thankfully, and as you say sometimes the problem is in the building. But even if I decide to try to hand-write a ticket, what does that accomplish? The tech doing the Mercedes timing chain is at a standstill because he can’t access the torque specs for the cover. The tech with the Transit 250 torn apart is dead in the water because we can’t access the web portal to see if the fleet manager has approved the work. I just replaced a BCM, but the car is dead because I can’t download the software into it. The lube kid found a leaky radiator, but he can’t upload the pics and findings to the service writer, so he has to walk into the office and tell her. Since parts ordering is done online, she has to now call around to find one. She doesn’t know what labor to charge since the labor guide is online as well. One guy was able to finish his brake job, but we have no way to email the customer. Even if the customer was there, credit card processing is web based as well. Of course there are work-arounds, but are they worth the effort? When we lost all internet at 2pm and got word that the outage would last 3-5 hours, we just gave up for the day. But since the time clock is web based as well, we had to correct everyone’s time card the next day. Handwriting repair orders might work for a one-man or mom and pop store, but impossible for a medium sized shop with 11 stalls. ---
**Author:** ![MikeInNH](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a587f6/32.png) [@MikeInNH](https://community.cartalk.com/u/MikeInNH)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2024, 8:49pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133/60 "2024-01-20T20:49:29Z")
> [@asemaster](#): > > The tech doing the Mercedes timing chain is at a standstill because he can’t access the torque specs for the cover You don’t do other types of jobs - like oil changes. You can’t do oil changes or tire rotations or replace a starter without internet access. I’m not a professional mechanic and I don’t need the internet to do preventative maintenance. I’m sure there are jobs that you do need it, but I don’t see a business shutting down because no internet access. > [@asemaster](#): > > Not often thankfully, and as you say sometimes the problem is in the building. That’s NOT what I’m saying. I’m saying it’s more and likely at the URL you’re trying to reach or somewhere in the path. If you have a business in an area that has flaky internet access, then either move the business, or definitely get some sort of backup system. [Previous page](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133.md?page=2) [Next page](https://community.cartalk.com/t/dealing-with-the-www/194133.md?page=4)