# 'Deadly Convenience: Keyless Cars and Their Carbon Monoxide Toll' **URL:** \ **Category:** Safety\ **Created:** [May 13, 2018, 1:26pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307 "2018-05-13T13:26:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![RandomTroll](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/randomtroll/32/12184_2.png) [@RandomTroll](https://community.cartalk.com/u/RandomTroll)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 1:26pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/1 "2018-05-13T13:26:57Z")
> **[Deadly Convenience: Keyless Cars and Their Carbon Monoxide Toll](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/13/business/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll.html)** > > Weaned from using a key, drivers have left cars running in garages, spewing exhaust into homes. Despite years of deaths, regulatory action has lagged. ---
**Author:** ![PvtPublic](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/pvtpublic/32/13089_2.png) [@PvtPublic](https://community.cartalk.com/u/PvtPublic)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 1:42pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/2 "2018-05-13T13:42:43Z")
Rehash of old news, ABC report from Aug. 2015. > **[Keyless Ignitions Led to Carbon Monoxide Deaths and Should Have Been...](https://abcnews.go.com/US/keyless-ignitions-led-carbon-monoxide-deaths-recalled-suit/story?id=33344253)** > > The defendants allegedly knew or should have known the cars were risky. Included in a discussion here from Feb. 2016 > [@Gimmicks in newer cars these days](https://community.cartalk.com/t/gimmicks-in-newer-cars-these-days/92472): > > What do you guys think of all these new cars coming out with the “push to start” button now to start the engine? It seems crazy that now most newer cars don’t even have keys anymore… Do you think it’s just a way for the dealers to get customers back when it eventually breaks down and then they can charge $$$ to fix the problem ? (Because everything electronically eventually breaks down). I guess what I wanna know is if this new technology has any real advantages over having actual keys to start… ---
**Author:** ![VOLVO-V70](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/8e8cbc/32.png) [@VOLVO-V70](https://community.cartalk.com/u/VOLVO-V70)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 1:45pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/3 "2018-05-13T13:45:38Z")
Must take a long time for the New York Times to get to RT in the desert . ---
**Author:** ![ledhed75](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f6c823/32.png) [@ledhed75](https://community.cartalk.com/u/ledhed75)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 2:02pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/4 "2018-05-13T14:02:39Z")
This is the first I’ve seen of this issue myself. Personally I think we’ve crossed a bit of a line on computers/convenience vs. being aware of and responsible for our own driving. I have a 2009 Dodge with one of the “keyless” key fobs. It’s not quite like the ones described in this article… but in the 2 years I’ve had the car, I think I’ve gone through 4 fobs. They’ve failed for different reasons. But I know if I had an actual metal key… it probably would be the first and last key I’d ever need for the car. I don’t want an internet hot spot in any of my cars. Reason being, unlikely as it may be, the car could be hacked by someone. Though the new safety equipment for lane changes, automatic braking, and all that, is appealing to a degree… for some folks, it will just lead to “reliance on the computer” and ultimately inattention. For the foreseeable future, I’ll continue to buy used cars to avoid these sorts of issues. My next vehicle after the Dodge will hopefully have a metal key. ---
**Author:** ![the\_same\_mountainbike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@the\_same\_mountainbike](https://community.cartalk.com/u/the_same_mountainbike)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 2:43pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/5 "2018-05-13T14:43:34Z")
> [@PvtPublic](#): > > What do you guys think of all these new cars coming out with the “push to start” button now to start the engine? I don’t like them. Too many issues. And frankly, I don’t see any benefit to them. Have we gotten so lazy that we can’t turn a key? ---
**Author:** ![jtsanders](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c2a13f/32.png) [@jtsanders](https://community.cartalk.com/u/jtsanders)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 2:55pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/6 "2018-05-13T14:55:18Z")
Turn a key? Push a button? It seems the same from an effort standpoint. Push button starting is a good thing for me as my arthritic thumbs get worse. It seems to me that an electronic system for starting and finding the fob to allow starting is probably less expensive than the mechanism for the keyed ignition in the long run. Both systems have safety problems. Keyed starting is a safety issue if drivers have too many keys on their key ring I’m sure you remember that. ---
**Author:** ![B.L.E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/848f3c/32.png) [@B.L.E](https://community.cartalk.com/u/B.L.E)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 3:11pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/7 "2018-05-13T15:11:56Z")
> [@PvtPublic](#): > > (Because everything electronically eventually breaks down). So does everything mechanical. I used to service televisions back in the days of old school mechanical tuners and it was the tuners that gave the most trouble. Today’s electronic tuners give very little trouble, mostly dead batteries in the remote or the remote lost behind the cushions on the sofa. Today’s electronic ignition is an order of magnitude more reliable than old school points and condensers. I’m not a fan of gimmicks myself but there’s no way I’m going back to points and carburetors, and I have had more than one mechanical key opened lock fail on me. As far as hacking is concerned, the old school key switches could be hot wired and locks could be picked. ---
**Author:** ![sgtrock21](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/sgtrock21/32/246_2.png) [@sgtrock21](https://community.cartalk.com/u/sgtrock21)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 3:32pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/8 "2018-05-13T15:32:22Z")
The fob for my 2010 Kia can unlock the doors and trunk or lock the doors. The only thing I normally use it for is the trunk. I wish it opened with the key. The fob stays in my pocket. Why would I use it to unlock the door when I still need the key to start the car? I lock the doors with the armrest button when I exit. My key ring has one car key and one house key. ---
**Author:** ![B.L.E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/848f3c/32.png) [@B.L.E](https://community.cartalk.com/u/B.L.E)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 3:43pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/9 "2018-05-13T15:43:40Z")
I think the idea is to keep the trunk contents secure when using valet parking. You only give the valet the key and you keep the fob and he can’t access the trunk. ---
**Author:** ![sgtrock21](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/sgtrock21/32/246_2.png) [@sgtrock21](https://community.cartalk.com/u/sgtrock21)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 5:37pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/10 "2018-05-13T17:37:05Z")
Not a very good idea when the trunk can be easily accessed with the lever next to the driver seat. ---
**Author:** ![VOLVO-V70](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/8e8cbc/32.png) [@VOLVO-V70](https://community.cartalk.com/u/VOLVO-V70)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 5:52pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/11 "2018-05-13T17:52:54Z")
I can unlock the drivers door while approaching vehicle with one push on remote or two to unlock all doors . I see no reason to use key to unlock door . And I like the push to start feature . ---
**Author:** ![bing](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/bing/32/4619_2.png) [@bing](https://community.cartalk.com/u/bing)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 6:30pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/12 "2018-05-13T18:30:00Z")
5h Must take a long time for the New York Times to get to RT in the desert . Just takes time to shovel all the manure in the Times out of the way first. ---
**Author:** ![Nevada\_545](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/nevada_545/32/41232_2.png) [@Nevada\_545](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Nevada_545)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 6:57pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/13 "2018-05-13T18:57:20Z")
> [@sgtrock21](#): > > Not a very good idea when the trunk can be easily accessed with the lever next to the driver seat. I can switch off the trunk control lever in my 1996 Dodge, no so in a 2010 KIA? ---
**Author:** ![jtsanders](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c2a13f/32.png) [@jtsanders](https://community.cartalk.com/u/jtsanders)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 7:06pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/14 "2018-05-13T19:06:54Z")
In my Accord, there is a fob for unlocking the doors and starting the car, but no trunk access. I can also lock the trunk lever below the drivers seat. ---
**Author:** ![B.L.E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/848f3c/32.png) [@B.L.E](https://community.cartalk.com/u/B.L.E)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 8:59pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/15 "2018-05-13T20:59:18Z")
> [@sgtrock21](#): > > Not a very good idea when the trunk can be easily accessed with the lever next to the driver seat. Well, there goes **THAT** theory! ---
**Author:** ![Whitey](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/whitey/32/24680_2.png) [@Whitey](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Whitey)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 9:36pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/16 "2018-05-13T21:36:37Z")
I always thought the advantage of keyless entry is that it makes the car harder to steal. It’s interesting to see people blame absent minded behavior on the car. My former sister in law had this problem (of absentmindedly leaving the car running) long before keyless entry was available. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Rugerson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a183cd/32.png) [@Rick\_Rugerson](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Rick_Rugerson)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 9:52pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/17 "2018-05-13T21:52:50Z")
WOW. Imagine if we made drunk driving into a front line issue and put knee jerk reactions into place? Frivolous lawsuit. Maybe we should hold the alcohol companies responsible. Half of the drivers that gassed themselves probably had some alcohol in them. The problem is America, the lawyers and the judge love their alkihol. ---
**Author:** ![RandomTroll](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/randomtroll/32/12184_2.png) [@RandomTroll](https://community.cartalk.com/u/RandomTroll)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2018, 10:26pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/18 "2018-05-13T22:26:54Z")
> [@PvtPublic](#): > > Rehash of old news, ABC report from Aug. 2015. No TV out where I live. > [@VOLVO\_V70](#): > > Must take a long time for the New York Times to get to RT in the desert . Those pigeons can carry only a page at a time. > [@VOLVO\_V70](#): > > I like the push to start feature . Remember push-button transmissions? A friend had one on his Valiant. > [@Whitey](#): > > I always thought the advantage of keyless entry is that it makes the car harder to steal. I read a story in the ‘LA Weekly’ in the '90s about a Serbian crime syndicate that had computer-controlled radios that sent thousands of combinations/second. They’d stand next to spiffy cars in LA, biding their time until the computer hit, hot-wire it and drive off. Somebody observed that if you make something fool-proof, somebody will invent a better fool. ---
**Author:** ![sgtrock21](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/sgtrock21/32/246_2.png) [@sgtrock21](https://community.cartalk.com/u/sgtrock21)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2018, 1:09am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/19 "2018-05-14T01:09:08Z")
Nope. I checked the owner manual. It is cable actuated not electric. ---
**Author:** ![the\_same\_mountainbike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@the\_same\_mountainbike](https://community.cartalk.com/u/the_same_mountainbike)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2018, 2:44pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307/20 "2018-05-14T14:44:17Z")
> [@Rick\_Rugerson](#): > > WOW. Imagine if we made drunk driving into a front line issue and put knee jerk reactions into place? Frivolous lawsuit. > > Maybe we should hold the alcohol companies responsible. > > Half of the drivers that gassed themselves probably had some alcohol in them. > > The problem is America, the lawyers and the judge love their alkihol. You’re on the wrong thread, Rick. The subject here is keyless cars and the problems people have had with them turning themselves on in garages. The subject of the thread is not alcohol or the legislative and judicial systems. Keyless ignition systems are not statutorily mandated or regulated. [Next page](https://community.cartalk.com/t/deadly-convenience-keyless-cars-and-their-carbon-monoxide-toll/117307.md?page=2)