I agree with @Rod Knox that safety, or at least the appearance of it, has taken on a life of its own, often at substantial cost to those unwittingly paying for it. Have you seen the price of child seats and other mandatory safety equipment lately? Not to mention the fact that it should be up to the parents of said child whether it’s appropriate to ride in a pickup bed, not a government agency.
I understand that there are parts of the country where a vehicle safety inspection may make sense, but I also resent the implication that motorists are stupid and need such a thing. Think about all the money spent administering and enforcing these “necessary programs.”
I reject the claim that we’re paying any significant premium for the safety equipment in today’s cars. Take the Honda Civic. A 2013 Civic sedan is the equivalent or larger/better/safer/more economical/faster in every way than a 1988 Accord sedan. The Civic costs $18,965, the Accord $13,935. Adjust the Accord price for inflation, you get $24,330!
Yup, classic strawman argument. 'Cause everybody who questions any gov’t mandated reg whatsoever is in favor of exposed metal edges in the passenger compartment, and dumping dioxins in the drinking water…
The most basic car we owned was a 2 door 1971 Mercury Comet, 6 cylinder, no power steering, no air, cheap plastic upholstery, basic radio only. Back windows did not wind down. No one liked this car; I ended up giving it to my mother-in-law who used it for grocery shopping. She had to put a sheepskin cover on the front seat to prevent scorching in the summer and cold as ice in the winter.
Unlike Triedaq’s Maverick, this car was not trouble-free; the heater core went, the warm up system for the engine constantly malfunctioned, and it started rusting at an early age.
You have seen through me, @Joe. My post was part of the conspiracy to reduce the world population through poor automobile design. We’ll be forced to start over with efforts to add flouride to the drinking water.
I don’t question the idea that cars are safer now than they have ever been. And it’s not like there is a line item on the car invoice that shows how much these things cost us. But years and years of R&D don’t come free. How much would that 2013 Civic cost without stability control, side airbags, lane change warning, parking sensors, etc. All the money that has been spent developing and implementing these features are rolled into the price of the car. I don’t want to use the word “fleece”, but I can’t think of a better word to describe some of the things that are forced upon us in the name of safety.
Rod was just pointing out that free of all the “requirements” carmakers face here, it might be possible to market a simple basic car for a low price.
Actually @Rod Knox, I was referencing Whitey’s post re: “chicken little” governance. Funny comeback though, regardless.
On a whimsical note, with mandated stability control, there will rapidly come a day when nobody is able to execute a bootleg turn, or even know what one is! Makes me sad…
Somebody oughtta do something…because saying “I hate induced oversteer” is like saying “I hate freedom!!” (or something like that…)
Yes, @asemaster. I must assume that a no frills, minimalistic automobile could be very affordable on the front end and comparatively more trouble free and vastly simpler to maintain and repair over it’s usable life. The VW 181 always comes to mind because it fit into that category nicely but like so many efforts it was at the wrong time.
Living in a small town with the nearest interstate 75 miles away and driving less than 5,000 miles each year rarely, if ever exceeding 50 mph, even my S-10 Blazer is more vehicle than I need. Something slightly more substantial and powerful than a golf cart would be nice. And I feel sure there are a few others whose needs are similar.
I spent some time in countries with low incomes and no safety and environmental regulations. I had a ride in a Latin American country in a basic Japanese made Jeep. It had no seat belts, no collapsing steering column, no catalytic converter, no crash padding of any sort, and resembled a basic US army Jeep of WW II.
It had a simple carb, and would have been easy to maintain and tune up. Such a vehicle sells for very little compared to a modern Jeep Wrangler, for instance. Also Toyota used old dies and fixtures to make these vehicles. Japanese companies build to serve local markets; if all that extra stuff adds to the price and makes servicing difficult, they do it the simple way.
US companies used to ship their old dies to Latin American and Australia where low volume precluded new designs. In my Spanish course, “Destinos”, which used to run on PBS, written in 1992, the star of the program, Raquel, rides around Buenos Aires, in a new 1967 Ford “limousine”. The car is virtually identical to one my neighbor had in 1970.
The Ford Falcon was produced in Australia for many years after it was discontinued in the US.
We bought a new Dart in 1977(?). Stripped model except for the radio. It was stripped of its stock radio over a weekend in one of Clic-N-Clac’s favorite cities. We had to ask for a oil dip stick before we took possession. Boy did our butts sweat on that vinyl bench seat. We learned to accept the offered performance package. :<}]
A multi-line dealer I worked for back in the 80s was rumored to be taking on a new line of cars that were going to be inexpensive. Rumor was that I might be the guy taking care of them service wise and I left before this happened. Half the rumor turned out to be true…
That car was the Yugo. What are a lot of complaints about in regards to the Yugo? Bare bones, noisy, tinny, lacking power, etc, etc.
Buyers had a 3995 option for a cheap, no frills car and most chose to go another route.
Do you really think anybody would buy a new car w/o ac nowadays?It gets really hot where I live, and ac is an absolute necessity.
Yes, I would purchase a car w/out AC. In fact I wouldn’t purchase a car with AC. I’ve never owned a car that had AC. I understand that in many areas of the country AC is now considered mandatory, and most people want AC. But I don’t live in those areas and I don’t want AC. Likewise with automatic xmissions. I wouldn’t purchase a car with one, but I understand most people want them. In this ideal-o-world I’m envisioning, the cheapo car we’re discussing in this thread would have AC and automatic xmission as “for-a-price” options. Then if you wanted them, no problem, they’d be available for purchase.
@Docnick, the cars you describe, while reasonably priced in their bare bones version, haven’t yet proved to have Toyota/Honda reliability over the long term.
There’s probably multiple reasons why this cheapo car isn’t available on any new car dealer lot. Like the cost of gov’t mandated functionality, that bare bones equipped cars don’t offer much profit potential, and a cheapo model sitting on the lot would compete with and undercut the price of the vendor’s higher priced and higher profit models.
The Mobius One may well be an excellent car for the African market. I doubt that it would or even could meet front or side impact requirements. You might refer to those requirements as our society’s price of admission to our auto market. Some people think that our auto safety regulations are way overblown, while others think they aren’t enough. Put those extremes and the rest of us in the middle together, and you get our society’s desires for safety. Mobius One doesn’t fit here, but it could be a real winner at home.
@MikeInNH, like I say, the cheapo-car would have AC as an option. You’d just pay more for an AC equipped car. Or alternatively, those of us who don’t want AC would pay less. In any event, both the dealership and manufacturer would be more than happy to acommodate all AC desires, as I expect AC is a profit center for both.
Years ago I remember reading that carmakers often make an ‘option’ into ‘standard’ when more than about 90% of cars get ordered that way. I bet a/c is at the over 90% point. It simplifies manufacture to limit configurations.
My beef? It seems like sunroofs are going that way on up-model cars (not that upmodel - try and get Fusion with many options, without a sunroof, can’t be done). I HATE sunroofs because they cut the headroom I really need.
@db4690 … lol … yeah, you’re probably right. When I was surfing the lots for my trusty Corolla, now 20+ years in service, even though most of the US purchased Corolla’s at the time were made at the Corolla factory not more than 15 miles from where I live, I simply could not find one with a manual xmission on any dealer lot near here. And it was too late in the car-season to order one from the factory. The dealership that was helping me out however did find one eventually in another town in Calif, and had it shipped to them. I got the sense that the dealership owner was very puzzled; he couldn’t figure out why this customer of his wanted a manual xmission Corolla when his lot was filled with automatic equipped Corollas of any color and option desired.
As I recall I paid $12,500, but there was a $1000 factory rebate, and a $500 dealership rebate, so the cost to me before taxes and fees was $11,000.