# At wits end 09 Patriot **URL:** \ **Category:** Maintenance/Repairs\ **Created:** [October 27, 2019, 12:13am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/at-wits-end-09-patriot/151562 "2019-10-27T00:13:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Sean-Paul\_Aitken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Sean-Paul\_Aitken](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Sean-Paul_Aitken)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2019, 12:13am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/at-wits-end-09-patriot/151562/1 "2019-10-27T00:13:38Z")
Hello! My wife has a 09 Patriot, 2.4L 4x4. One day, the car would not start. - I tried jumping it to no avail. - Replaced the starter, did not fix the problem. - Tested battery, low cca, still under warranty, replaced for free. Did not fix problem. - Used a TIPM (Total Integrated Power Module) from a friend that had some issues, but the car was able to start a few times! Dead in the water after driving to the store. Miraculously turned on again a few minutes later. - Replaced TIPM. No dice. - Discovered the car will fire up 100% of the time if I do a hard reset by undoing both battery terminals and touching them to each other. After driving around and shutting it down however, it will not start up again without a hard reset. What is going on!? ---
**Author:** ![George\_San\_Jose1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e5b9ba/32.png) [@George\_San\_Jose1](https://community.cartalk.com/u/George_San_Jose1)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2019, 12:22am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/at-wits-end-09-patriot/151562/2 "2019-10-27T00:22:42Z")
Explain what you mean by “won’t start”. Does it crank ok — that rrr rrr rrr sound w/the key in “start” – but won’t catch and run? Or is the problem a fails to crank? ---
**Author:** ![Sean-Paul\_Aitken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Sean-Paul\_Aitken](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Sean-Paul_Aitken)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2019, 5:37am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/at-wits-end-09-patriot/151562/3 "2019-10-27T05:37:44Z")
When I turn the key, i get one good click from the starter. If I hold the key it will click every second. After a few tries im assuming a safety mechanism kicks in because everything does dark. ---
**Author:** ![db4690](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/db4690/32/2583_2.png) [@db4690](https://community.cartalk.com/u/db4690)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2019, 5:51am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/at-wits-end-09-patriot/151562/4 "2019-10-27T05:51:31Z")
> [@Sean-Paul\_Aitken](#): > > Replaced TIPM. No dice. please elaborate new TIPM . . . ?! used TIPM . . . ?! rebuilt TIPM . . . ?! ---
**Author:** ![missileman](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/missileman/32/1366_2.png) [@missileman](https://community.cartalk.com/u/missileman)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2019, 12:37pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/at-wits-end-09-patriot/151562/5 "2019-10-27T12:37:15Z")
Had the same problem with my Liberty. I replaced the starter relay. No problems since. ---
**Author:** ![Sean-Paul\_Aitken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Sean-Paul\_Aitken](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Sean-Paul_Aitken)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2019, 4:11pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/at-wits-end-09-patriot/151562/6 "2019-10-27T16:11:30Z")
> **[Home - MAK'S](https://tipmrebuilders.com/)** > > MAK'STIPM REBUILDERSShop Tipms Chyrsler/Dodge/Jeep/VW Vehicles A FAULTY TIPM CAN OFTEN FEEL LIKE YOUR CAR IS POSSESSED AND HAS A MIND OF ITS OWN. SYMPTOMS CAN INCLUDE STARTER NOT ENGAGING, HARD START, (WILL TAKE A FEW TIMES TO FINALLY START) ENGINE... ---
**Author:** ![db4690](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/db4690/32/2583_2.png) [@db4690](https://community.cartalk.com/u/db4690)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2019, 4:36pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/at-wits-end-09-patriot/151562/7 "2019-10-27T16:36:51Z")
I clicked on the link It seems there really aren’t many choices for a 2009 Patriot . . . at least from that vendor you mentioned It’s either a used TIPM . . . or call the vendor and ask if they’ll fix your existing TIPM Unless I hear otherwise, I’ll assume you bought a used TIPM from the vendor ---
**Author:** ![Sean-Paul\_Aitken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Sean-Paul\_Aitken](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Sean-Paul_Aitken)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2019, 4:54pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/at-wits-end-09-patriot/151562/8 "2019-10-27T16:54:14Z")
They rebuild those with better parts, at least that was my take away. Thats what I replaced it with. I did a hard reset this morning and scanned it resulting in some codes… I knew it had a small evap leak from the gas cap that was setting off the CE light, so I didnt initially rush to check it. P1607, U1412 P161B P0610 Reckon i need a new PCM? ---
**Author:** ![thegreendrag0n](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/thegreendrag0n/32/9265_2.png) [@thegreendrag0n](https://community.cartalk.com/u/thegreendrag0n)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2019, 5:43pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/at-wits-end-09-patriot/151562/9 "2019-10-27T17:43:39Z")
@missileman gave a good advise above: check/replace starter relay ---
**Author:** ![Sean-Paul\_Aitken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Sean-Paul\_Aitken](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Sean-Paul_Aitken)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2019, 6:21pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/at-wits-end-09-patriot/151562/10 "2019-10-27T18:21:34Z")
So the starter relay has several relays next to it in the same board, all the same type, I swapped them around, nothing changed. The board itself could be bad I suppose… I think I’d have to pull the wires out and wire them directly to the relay if that was the case ---
**Author:** ![George\_San\_Jose1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e5b9ba/32.png) [@George\_San\_Jose1](https://community.cartalk.com/u/George_San_Jose1)\ **Post date:** [October 29, 2019, 2:26am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/at-wits-end-09-patriot/151562/11 "2019-10-29T02:26:40Z")
The best way to get to the bottom of a fails to crank is to measure the voltage at both terminals on the starter motors with the key in “start”. There’s a big thick main power wire, and a thinner wire for the start signal. Probe from terminal to starter case. Both should measure at least 10.5 volts. If they do, replace the starter motor. If one or both doesn’t, work from the starter towards the battery to find out why. This is sort of an awkward measurement to make, but it usually gets to the heart of the problem quickly.