# A Power Struggle Over Cobalt Rattles the Clean Energy Revolution **URL:** \ **Category:** General Discussion\ **Created:** [November 21, 2021, 2:42am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/a-power-struggle-over-cobalt-rattles-the-clean-energy-revolution/180780 "2021-11-21T02:42:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![woodyandsue\_176929](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ac91a4/32.png) [@woodyandsue\_176929](https://community.cartalk.com/u/woodyandsue_176929)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2021, 2:42am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/a-power-struggle-over-cobalt-rattles-the-clean-energy-revolution/180780/1 "2021-11-21T02:42:00Z")
Really interesting article on the state we’re all in. (NYT) . Am unable to send the link,but if interested, I can copy&paste the entire text. ---
**Author:** ![keith](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/keith/32/5518_2.png) [@keith](https://community.cartalk.com/u/keith)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2021, 8:45pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/a-power-struggle-over-cobalt-rattles-the-clean-energy-revolution/180780/3 "2021-11-21T20:45:32Z")
Some of the newer designs in progress use carbon instead of cobalt. They make the carbon out of cotton. Makes you wonder now that Ford is building a battery plant out in the middle of a cotton patch. ---
**Author:** ![weekend-warrior](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/weekend-warrior/32/26122_2.png) [@weekend-warrior](https://community.cartalk.com/u/weekend-warrior)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2021, 8:48pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/a-power-struggle-over-cobalt-rattles-the-clean-energy-revolution/180780/4 "2021-11-21T20:48:26Z")
> [@keith](#): > > carbon out of cotton interesting. I never knew that. I learn something new all the time here. ---
**Author:** ![bing](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/bing/32/4619_2.png) [@bing](https://community.cartalk.com/u/bing)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2021, 9:27pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/a-power-struggle-over-cobalt-rattles-the-clean-energy-revolution/180780/5 "2021-11-21T21:27:00Z")
You can’t copy and paste an article behind a pay wall due to copy right issues and the rules here. Just sayin’. I can’t read the article but from another source it seems that US holdings on cobalt in Africa were sold out to the Chinese a few years ago. I didn’t bother reading that whole article either. But see any parallels with the push for electrics and China attempting to corner the market? We won WW II largely because we choked the energy supply for Germany. Comrade Bing out. ---
**Author:** ![woodyandsue\_176929](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ac91a4/32.png) [@woodyandsue\_176929](https://community.cartalk.com/u/woodyandsue_176929)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2021, 10:11pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/a-power-struggle-over-cobalt-rattles-the-clean-energy-revolution/180780/6 "2021-11-21T22:11:54Z")
“I can’t read the article but from another source it seems that US holdings on cobalt in Africa were sold out to the Chinese a few years ago.” Yes. “We won WW II largely because we choked the energy supply for Germany”. I’m assuming the energy supply was Poland, France, etc.- places that were liberated. Interestingly, seems that China is focused on state-owned control of companies, while WW2 Germany privatized state-owned companies; two opposite directions with the intention of creating powerful, self-sustaining economies. Complicated and who benefits? Mercifully, this forum is apolitical:) ---
**Author:** ![VDCdriver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/vdcdriver/32/30_2.png) [@VDCdriver](https://community.cartalk.com/u/VDCdriver)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2021, 10:16pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/a-power-struggle-over-cobalt-rattles-the-clean-energy-revolution/180780/7 "2021-11-21T22:16:22Z")
> [@woodyandsue\_176929](#): > > I’m assuming the energy supply was Poland, France, etc Ummm… no… If you had been a student in my US History class 😉, you would have known about the various US air attacks on Romania, which… _eventually_… destroyed Germany’s access to Romania’s rich oil resources: > **[Operation Tidal Wave](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Tidal_Wave)** > > Operation Tidal Wave was an air attack by bombers of the United States Army Air Forces (USAAF) based in Libya on nine oil refineries around Ploiești, Romania on 1 August 1943, during World War II. It was a strategic bombing mission and part of the "oil campaign" to deny petroleum-based fuel to the Axis powers. The mission resulted in "no curtailment of overall product output". > This operation was one of the costliest for the USAAF in the European Theater, with 53 aircraft and 660 air crewmen lo... ---
**Author:** ![Mustangman](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/mustangman/32/44130_2.png) [@Mustangman](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Mustangman)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2021, 10:25pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/a-power-struggle-over-cobalt-rattles-the-clean-energy-revolution/180780/8 "2021-11-21T22:25:12Z")
Additionally the Allies cut off Japan’s drive to capture the oil reserves in the South Pacific. It greatly affected the ability of their navy fight after what they’d hoped would be a crippling blow to the US navy in the Pacific. ---
**Author:** ![circuitsmith](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/circuitsmith/32/40376_2.png) [@circuitsmith](https://community.cartalk.com/u/circuitsmith)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2021, 10:25pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/a-power-struggle-over-cobalt-rattles-the-clean-energy-revolution/180780/9 "2021-11-21T22:25:37Z")
> [@keith](#): > > Some of the newer designs in progress use carbon instead of cobalt. I watched this recently: [![](https://global.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/original/3X/c/f/cf35af58db51926c38fbad63d39c9978c6aa40b2.jpeg "How Removing Cobalt From Batteries Can Make EVs Cheaper") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFL8iQ3p3cI) ---
**Author:** ![Mustangman](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/mustangman/32/44130_2.png) [@Mustangman](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Mustangman)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2021, 10:28pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/a-power-struggle-over-cobalt-rattles-the-clean-energy-revolution/180780/10 "2021-11-21T22:28:19Z")
> [@woodyandsue\_176929](#): > > China is focused on state-owned control of companies, Because they are communists and that is their political system. > [@woodyandsue\_176929](#): > > while WW2 Germany privatized state-owned companies Because they weren’t communists. ---
**Author:** ![woodyandsue\_176929](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ac91a4/32.png) [@woodyandsue\_176929](https://community.cartalk.com/u/woodyandsue_176929)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2021, 10:43pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/a-power-struggle-over-cobalt-rattles-the-clean-energy-revolution/180780/11 "2021-11-21T22:43:47Z")
Okay, but my intention was that their energy was sourced from defeated nations. Thanks for the info. ---
**Author:** ![woodyandsue\_176929](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ac91a4/32.png) [@woodyandsue\_176929](https://community.cartalk.com/u/woodyandsue_176929)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2021, 10:47pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/a-power-struggle-over-cobalt-rattles-the-clean-energy-revolution/180780/12 "2021-11-21T22:47:25Z")
I figured we knew that.! ---
**Author:** ![Mustangman](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/mustangman/32/44130_2.png) [@Mustangman](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Mustangman)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 12:52am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/a-power-struggle-over-cobalt-rattles-the-clean-energy-revolution/180780/13 "2021-11-22T00:52:45Z")
China’s state owned companies are directed to do whatever China tells them to do. If that is to capture strategic resources, they do. No matter the cost to the company, the Africans, or the environment. Heck, they foul their own land and enslave their own people here in 2021, why not another continent’s? Public or private companies can’t be commanded to do that except under some variant of authoritarian government. WW2 Germans, for example. ---
**Author:** ![woodyandsue\_176929](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ac91a4/32.png) [@woodyandsue\_176929](https://community.cartalk.com/u/woodyandsue_176929)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 3:07am UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/a-power-struggle-over-cobalt-rattles-the-clean-energy-revolution/180780/14 "2021-11-22T03:07:41Z")
exactly what I meant ---
**Author:** ![VDCdriver](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/vdcdriver/32/30_2.png) [@VDCdriver](https://community.cartalk.com/u/VDCdriver)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 1:22pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/a-power-struggle-over-cobalt-rattles-the-clean-energy-revolution/180780/15 "2021-11-22T13:22:53Z")
> [@woodyandsue\_176929](#): > > my intention was that their energy was sourced from defeated nations. … from oil deposits in Poland and France? 😏 ---
**Author:** ![woodyandsue\_176929](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ac91a4/32.png) [@woodyandsue\_176929](https://community.cartalk.com/u/woodyandsue_176929)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 1:53pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/a-power-struggle-over-cobalt-rattles-the-clean-energy-revolution/180780/16 "2021-11-22T13:53:30Z")
pierogis and pinot noir— ---
**Author:** ![Cavell](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/cartalk/user_avatar/community.cartalk.com/cavell/32/43396_2.png) [@Cavell](https://community.cartalk.com/u/Cavell)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2021, 2:01pm UTC](https://community.cartalk.com/t/a-power-struggle-over-cobalt-rattles-the-clean-energy-revolution/180780/17 "2021-11-22T14:01:59Z")
China is trying to fund/build for free many projects in Africa. Or any other place. They use the financial obligation to control that nations govt. I say let them build it and then tell China to kiss off. But they have their hyper missiles now. Why does China need 1000 hyper missiles that can circle the earth?