I’m going to stick my neck out a little and carry this a little further but have a professional alignment person verify this as I don’t do this every day. If your car drifts left, then you may have either too much caster on the right front wheel or too little caster on the left front wheel. I’d want to add caster to the left rather than reduce it on the right as more caster tends toward more steering stability.
You can look at a motorcycle fork set’s rearward angle to see caster. Your car’s front wheel pivots are to one side of the wheel, however, making caster in that situation cause a force that makes the wheel want to steer to the side toward its strut. Both front wheels together cancel out this steering force. Less caster on the left will make the right wheel’s left steering effect dominate.
I initially got an older car, long gone now, with steering pull to track straight ahead by adjusting the thrust angle of the rear wheels, keeping the toe of the rear wheels per spec. Then, however, the car very visibly dog tracked so I had to keep on trying and then finally came up with the front wheel caster angle solution.
Thank all of you for the advice. It made me feel good to have something to talk about when I called the Toyota service manager yesterday. As I said before I have a very cordial relationship with the service manager at the dealership but I think issues have reached a different level now. When I called yesterday the manager asked why I was calling again. I told him that the car is still pulling to one side,(left) and he said he has already adjusted it to specs. I kindly said that didn’t work and maybe there was some possible damage due to dropping the car or chaining it down to hard during shipping or the brake system was dragging on the left side. He discounted that. I mentioned that the car is still under warranty and I just wanted it to drive straight. He said he would call his district manager and would call me back in the afternoon. He didn’t call. So I think I now have to start the process of writing to Toyota in California. I will refer to the advice above when I start this new process. I bought this car on January 6th 2009 and it has been a nightmare for 7 months now. I should have taken the car back to the dealership the same day and given it back but I didn’t know the extent of this problem. I never had a car like this nor will I buy another Toyota product. Thanks again for the advice, I will be using it during the next phase of my quest.
Yet another possibility. Just as rear wheel thrust alignment could be used for me to cancel out the steering pull caused by unequal caster angles in front, inaccurate rear wheel thrust alignment can cause steering pull with a good front end. If both of your rear wheels were pointing slightly to the right and with front wheels pointing straight ahead, that would cause your car to steer in a large circle. You would need to put a little pressure on the right side of the steering wheel to go straight ahead.
Your alignment people should have checked rear wheel thrust alignment.
You can do a pretty good job of that yourself with a straight 1" x 4" x 10 ft board held along the side of each rear wheel to see how the other end of the board arrives at the front wheel. Both sides should appear the same with the front wheels pointing exactly straight ahead. You can pick out a very straight board at a lumber yard by eyeballing along each edge and from both ends. Make sure that your rear wheel tires don’t have uneven sidewalls. Sometimes even good tires have a little sidewall unevenness.
“So I think I now have to start the process of writing to Toyota in California. Thanks again for the advice, I will be using it during the next phase of my quest.”
You are very welcome. As I said in one of my earlier posts, if it could work for me and the friend for whom I wrote the letter, it can work for you. I would suggest that you use my sentence…“This defect substantially and materially impairs my ability to operate the vehicle safely” (or something to that effect), as the Toyota rep even specifically stated that he did not want anyone’s safe use of one of their vehicles to be be impaired. Clearly, they had read exactly what I stated in the letter.
“I never had a car like this nor will I buy another Toyota product.”
Whatever you do, DO NOT tell them that you will never buy a Toyota again! Tell them that you want to continue to be a Toyota customer, and that your satisfaction with the vehicle will determine whether you can continue as a customer. If you tell them that they have already lost you as a customer, that removes some of their motivation to help you, even if they are still legally bound by the terms of the Lemon Law in your state.
Good luck.
Please post back with the outcome of the process!
You don’t mention going to another Toyota dealer for a second opinion. Although they are few and far between, this may be another avenue to explore to find the path of least resistance to get this car’s steering pull repaired.
I tried to go to another Toyota dealer in Minneapolis. The “new” dealership said Toyota would not pay them because Carlson Toyota from Coon Rapids Minnesota had done the initial work on the car? I asked about the warranty and he said they would not do the work unless Toyota paid them. So much for the Toyota warranty.
Well, Vern, as I stated previously, you have been “Mr. Nice Guy” for far too long.
A problem on a new car that cannot be fixed after 6 or 7 visits to a dealership over a period of 6 months means that either the dealership is not trying very hard to fix this (despite the amiable service manager) or that the vehicle is truly defective beyond the point of repair.
In any event, I hope that you ignore those who are urging you to spend your own money on diagnosing and fixing this, and I REALLY hope that you ignore suggestions like the one about bending the shock tower in order to obtain proper wheel alignment.
It is time to hold Toyota’s feet to the fire, so to speak, and to utilize the legal means that exist to compel the manufacturer to either fix the problem upon the next repair attempt, or to give you a settlement under the terms of the Lemon Law in your state.
Thanks for the advice. Yes, I am starting the process of contacting Toyota in California. Rest assured I do not plan to do anything to the car myself. I will be civil but as you said, I will hold their feet to the fire.
Just be sure that your letter documents everything that is relevant:
VIN
Date of purchase
Model of car
Name of dealership that sold the car
Name of dealership(s) that have serviced the car
Dates of all repair attempts, as well as a quote from the service invoice for each attempt (example: Problem not found, Unable to duplicate problem, etc.)
Be sure to reference the statute number for the Lemon Law in your state (for example, in my state, it is N.J.S.A. 56:12-29 to 56:12-49)
Be sure to quote at least some verbiage from that statute in your letter, verifying for them that you actually know what is contained in that statute.
All of your contact telephone numbers and your e-mail address, so that they can respond to you.
Retain copies, and send the original via Certified Mail, Return Receipt Requested.
Trust me–This WILL work, and the only cost to you will be the postage!
Vern, I Can’t Send That TSB, But . . .
. . . anybody from Toyota (techs, reps, etc.) should be able to access TSB # T-SB-0391-08 .
This bulletin from December 24, 2008 is updated to include the 2002-2009 Prius and is now 15 pages long and replaces earlier versions. These guys should be able able to pull it up online and go over it with you or be nice and print a copy out for you. I have befriended service people at dealers who have printed out bulletins for me.
Read again. I said elongate the strut mounting holes at the top of the shock tower, not bend the shock tower. Bending of other unit body chassis components is commonly done to crash damaged cars to help restore correct wheel alignment.
I also stand firm in my conviction that the owner of this car should not have to pay one penny–to either the Toyota dealer or to an independent alignment specialist–for correction of this problem.
I seem to have a vague recollection of a posting some time back about a similar saga with someone trying to get their alignment corrected. It may even have been a Toyota. That person was working with the factory people to arrive at a solution. It was quite the drawn out process and, in the end, the solution was something simple but I cannot seem to recall the specifics. Something as simple as rotating the mount or some such deal. Although, they went through many attempts before the solution was found, including elongating the mount holes IIRC. Anyone else recall that thread?
The problem is the car generates to many electric ions, and thus causes the car to pull opposite the earths magnetic field. Sorry for the bad hummer : )