Latest NEWS: There is no PCV valve on the car… There is an Emissions Hose but no PCV Valve. It seems to be fine… I replaced the EGR an it is running smoother but then scheduled an appt with the deal to have the PCM reflashed. After flashing it did run better… for about 10 miles… Before I could even make it home it coded P0507. I cleared it and turned around to go back to the dealer and got about 1 mile before it coded P0171 and P0174. Finally I got to the dealer and waited several hours for the dealer to pull the codes from the car and tell me that it would be much longer and cost lots of money if I wanted them to touch it. Thereby proving that everything I had said to them about the car when I brought it in fell on deaf ears… They never even bothered checking the codes or anything I had said about the car. My faith in the dealer, already low has reached bottom and started to dig a hole…
They did say they suspected the cars PCM. So I ordered a used one and have it to install. Is there anything special about installing this? It appears to be easily accessable right in front of the battery in the engine compartment… Any advice?
@sellwood … it used to be the case that when a car developed drivability symptoms, a DIY’er could make some educated guesses and start replacing stuff and that would usually eventually fix the problem. On my 70’s Ford truck for example it hesitated on accel, I changed this and that, eventually I replaced the carb and that fixed it. The other stuff I did just gave me a tune-up in the process. But this technique isn’t very effective any more, with the complicated emissions functions and computer feedback systems used in cars now-a-days. Usually with the “replace stuff until it is fixed” DIY’er technique applied to post 1990 cars, you run out of money before the problem is found.
I think you will be time and money ahead by paying some $$ up front to get a proper diagnosis. You can then do the suggested repairs yourself if you like. There’s no reason to use a dealership unless this is under warranty. You’ll get better results a probably save $$ to ask for recommendations for a local inde shop who specializes in GM products for the diagnosis.
That used PCM might have to be flashed, to make sure it has the latest software. The dealer will also have to make sure it is set up for your specific vehicle, versus a different body style car or SUV
Not all independent shops are set up to flash PCMs. Ask questions before bringing the car and the used PCM to a shop
Also make sure the shop is comfortable with the idea of using the parts which you supplied. Again, not all shops are willing to do this.
If the used PCM is defective, or won’t work with your car, or doesn’t solve the customer’s problem, it can quickly escalate into an ugly situation. Some shops would rather not deal with this possibility. Understandably so, I might add.
My suspicion is that replacing the PCM isn’t going to change things but I could be wrong about that. The lean mixture codes for both banks seems to indicate a air leak in the intake area after the MAF sensor or perhaps the sensor itself is not working like it should and replacing it may help fix that issue.
Actually those are all the error codes… I once saw an idle too high error code but only once… … Here is the full test report… in several messages… Mode $06 report generated by Torque for Android
Vehicle VIN: Not present
Vehicle Manufacturer: Unknown
Vehicle Calibration ID: Not present
Test report:
MID:$01 TID:$01
Rich to Lean sensor threshold voltage(constant) - O2 Bank 1 Sensor 1
Max: 0.50874V Min: 0.50874V
Test result value: 0.50874V
PASS
MID:$01 TID:$02
Lean to Rich sensor threshold voltage(constant) - O2 Bank 1 Sensor 1
Max: 0.55986V Min: 0.55986V
Test result value: 0.55986V
PASS
MID:$01 TID:$03
Low sensor Voltage for switch time calculation - O2 Bank 1 Sensor 1
Max: 0.29939V Min: 0.29939V
Test result value: 0.29939V
PASS
MID:$01 TID:$04
High sensor Voltage for switch time calculation - O2 Bank 1 Sensor 1
Max: 0.5989V Min: 0.5989V
Test result value: 0.5989V
PASS
MID:$01 TID:$05
Rich to Lean sensor switch time(calculated) - O2 Bank 1 Sensor 1
Max: 200ms Min: 0ms
Test result value: 26ms
PASS
MID:$01 TID:$06
Lean to Rich sensor switch time(calculated) - O2 Bank 1 Sensor 1
Max: 200ms Min: 0ms
Test result value: 23ms
PASS
MID:$01 TID:$5f
O2 Bank 1 Sensor 1
Max: 40,982 Min: 10,432
Test result value: 14,080
PASS
MID:$01 TID:$80
O2 Bank 1 Sensor 1
Max: 65,535Changes Min: 55Changes
Test result value: 340Changes
PASS
MID:$02 TID:$8a
O2 Bank 1 Sensor 2
Max: 1,080Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 54Count
PASS
MID:$02 TID:$8b
O2 Bank 1 Sensor 2
Max: 1.10678V Min: 0.68576V
Test result value: 0.81594V
PASS
MID:$02 TID:$8c
O2 Bank 1 Sensor 2
Max: 0.29073V Min: 0V
Test result value: 0.04331V
PASS
MID:$05 TID:$01
Rich to Lean sensor threshold voltage(constant) - O2 Bank 2 Sensor 1
Max: 0.50191V Min: 0.50191V
Test result value: 0.50191V
PASS
MID:$05 TID:$02
Lean to Rich sensor threshold voltage(constant) - O2 Bank 2 Sensor 1
Max: 0.5529V Min: 0.5529V
Test result value: 0.5529V
PASS
MID:$05 TID:$03
Low sensor Voltage for switch time calculation - O2 Bank 2 Sensor 1
Max: 0.29939V Min: 0.29939V
Test result value: 0.29939V
PASS
MID:$05 TID:$04
High sensor Voltage for switch time calculation - O2 Bank 2 Sensor 1
Max: 0.5989V Min: 0.5989V
Test result value: 0.5989V
PASS
MID:$05 TID:$05
Rich to Lean sensor switch time(calculated) - O2 Bank 2 Sensor 1
Max: 200ms Min: 0ms
Test result value: 21ms
PASS
MID:$05 TID:$06
Lean to Rich sensor switch time(calculated) - O2 Bank 2 Sensor 1
Max: 200ms Min: 0ms
Test result value: 19ms
PASS
MID:$05 TID:$80
O2 Bank 2 Sensor 1
Max: 65,535Changes Min: 55Changes
Test result value: 364Changes
PASS
MID:$06 TID:$8a
O2 Bank 2 Sensor 2
Max: 1,080Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 12Count
PASS
MID:$06 TID:$8b
O2 Bank 2 Sensor 2
Max: 1.10678V Min: 0.68576V
Test result value: 0.70309V
PASS
MID:$06 TID:$8c
O2 Bank 2 Sensor 2
Max: 0.29073V Min: 0V
Test result value: 0.02599V
PASS
MID:$21 TID:$01
Rich to Lean sensor threshold voltage(constant) - Catalyst Monitor Bank 1
Max: 41,243mHz Min: 20,512mHz
Test result value: 288mHz
FAIL
MID:$21 TID:$03
Low sensor Voltage for switch time calculation - Catalyst Monitor Bank 1
Max: 41,245mHz Min: 4,128mHz
Test result value: 800mHz
FAIL
MID:$21 TID:$a0
Catalyst Monitor Bank 1
Test incomplete or dependant test failed
–
MID:$22 TID:$a0
Catalyst Monitor Bank 2
Test incomplete or dependant test failed
–
MID:$31 TID:$5f
EGR Monitor Bank 1
Max: 40,973 Min: 26,816
Test result value: 14,080
FAIL
MID:$31 TID:$a9
EGR Monitor Bank 1
Max: 0.727kPa Min: -32.768kPa
Test result value: -0.703kPa
PASS
MID:$3a TID:$c0
EVAP Monitor (cap off)
Test incomplete or dependant test failed
–
MID:$3a TID:$c1
EVAP Monitor (cap off)
Test incomplete or dependant test failed
–
MID:$3c TID:$c8
EVAP Monitor (0.040")
Test incomplete or dependant test failed
–
MID:$3c TID:$c9
EVAP Monitor (0.040")
Test incomplete or dependant test failed
–
MID:$3c TID:$ca
EVAP Monitor (0.040")
Test incomplete or dependant test failed
–
MID:$3c TID:$cb
EVAP Monitor (0.040")
Test incomplete or dependant test failed
–
MID:$3d TID:$c4
EVAP Monitor (0.020")
Test incomplete or dependant test failed
–
MID:$3d TID:$c5
EVAP Monitor (0.020")
Test incomplete or dependant test failed
–
MID:$3d TID:$c6
EVAP Monitor (0.020")
Test incomplete or dependant test failed
–
MID:$3d TID:$c7
EVAP Monitor (0.020")
Test incomplete or dependant test failed
–
MID:$41 TID:$18
O2 Heater Monitor Bank 1 - Sensor 1
Max: 41,266 Min: 4,128
Test result value: 6,208
PASS
MID:$41 TID:$1b
O2 Heater Monitor Bank 1 - Sensor 1
Max: 41,113 Min: 20,528
Test result value: 6,976
FAIL
MID:$41 TID:$1d
O2 Heater Monitor Bank 1 - Sensor 1
Max: 41,113 Min: 4,144
Test result value: 7,488
PASS
MID:$41 TID:$d2
O2 Heater Monitor Bank 1 - Sensor 1
Max: 17Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 0Count
PASS
MID:$41 TID:$d3
O2 Heater Monitor Bank 1 - Sensor 1
Test incomplete or dependant test failed
–
MID:$42 TID:$d2
O2 Heater Monitor Bank 1 - Sensor 2
Max: 17Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 0Count
PASS
MID:$42 TID:$d3
O2 Heater Monitor Bank 1 - Sensor 2
Test incomplete or dependant test failed
–
O2 Heater Monitor Bank 1 - Sensor 1
Max: 41,113 Min: 4,144
Test result value: 7,488
PASS
MID:$41 TID:$d2
O2 Heater Monitor Bank 1 - Sensor 1
Max: 17Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 0Count
PASS
MID:$41 TID:$d3
O2 Heater Monitor Bank 1 - Sensor 1
Test incomplete or dependant test failed
–
MID:$42 TID:$d2
O2 Heater Monitor Bank 1 - Sensor 2
Max: 17Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 0Count
PASS
MID:$42 TID:$d3
O2 Heater Monitor Bank 1 - Sensor 2
Test incomplete or dependant test failed
–
MID:$45 TID:$d2
O2 Heater Monitor Bank 2 - Sensor 1
Max: 17Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 0Count
PASS
MID:$45 TID:$d3
O2 Heater Monitor Bank 2 - Sensor 1
Test incomplete or dependant test failed
–
MID:$46 TID:$d2
O2 Heater Monitor Bank 2 - Sensor 2
Max: 17Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 0Count
PASS
MID:$46 TID:$d3
O2 Heater Monitor Bank 2 - Sensor 2
Test incomplete or dependant test failed
–
MID:$50 TID:$03
Low sensor Voltage for switch time calculation - O2 Heater Monitor Bank 4 - Sensor 4
Max: 45,072 Min: 6,162
Test result value: 65,520
FAIL
MID:$51 TID:$22
Max: 41,113 Min: 4,144
Test result value: 8,784
PASS
MID:$61 TID:$32
Heated Catalyst Monitor Bank 1
Max: 41,113 Min: 4,144
Test result value: 12,896
PASS
MID:$91 TID:$5f
Max: 40,968 Min: 26,816
Test result value: 14,080
FAIL
MID:$a1 TID:$01
Rich to Lean sensor threshold voltage(constant) - Misfire Monitor General Data
Max: 41,243 Min: 20,512
Test result value: 416
FAIL
MID:$a1 TID:$03
Low sensor Voltage for switch time calculation - Misfire Monitor General Data
Max: 41,245 Min: 20,512
Test result value: 928
FAIL
MID:$a1 TID:$04
High sensor Voltage for switch time calculation - Misfire Monitor General Data
Max: 41,246 Min: 4,128
Test result value: 1,184
FAIL
MID:$a1 TID:$0a
Sensor period(calculated) - Misfire Monitor General Data
Max: 41,252 Min: 4,128
Test result value: 2,720
FAIL
MID:$a2 TID:$0b
EWMA Misfire counts (average) for last 10 drive cycles - Misfire Cylinder 1 Data
Max: 65,535Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 0Count
PASS
MID:$a2 TID:$0c
Misfire counts for last/current driving cycles(calculated) - Misfire Cylinder 1 Data
Max: 65,535Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 0Count
PASS
MID:$a3 TID:$0b
EWMA Misfire counts (average) for last 10 drive cycles - Misfire Cylinder 2 Data
Max: 65,535Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 0Count
PASS
MID:$a3 TID:$0c
Misfire counts for last/current driving cycles(calculated) - Misfire Cylinder 2 Data
Max: 65,535Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 0Count
PASS
MID:$a4 TID:$0b
EWMA Misfire counts (average) for last 10 drive cycles - Misfire Cylinder 3 Data
Max: 65,535Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 0Count
PASS
MID:$a4 TID:$0c
Misfire counts for last/current driving cycles(calculated) - Misfire Cylinder 3 Data
Max: 65,535Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 0Count
PASS
MID:$a5 TID:$0b
EWMA Misfire counts (average) for last 10 drive cycles - Misfire Cylinder 4 Data
Max: 65,535Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 0Count
PASS
MID:$a5 TID:$0c
Misfire counts for last/current driving cycles(calculated) - Misfire Cylinder 4 Data
Max: 65,535Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 0Count
PASS
MID:$a6 TID:$0b
EWMA Misfire counts (average) for last 10 drive cycles - Misfire Cylinder 5 Data
Max: 65,535Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 0Count
PASS
MID:$a6 TID:$0c
Misfire counts for last/current driving cycles(calculated) - Misfire Cylinder 5 Data
Max: 65,535Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 0Count
PASS
MID:$a7 TID:$0b
EWMA Misfire counts (average) for last 10 drive cycles - Misfire Cylinder 6 Data
Max: 65,535Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 0Count
PASS
MID:$a7 TID:$0c
Misfire counts for last/current driving cycles(calculated) - Misfire Cylinder 6 Data
Max: 65,535Count Min: 0Count
Test result value: 2Count
PASS
MID:$b1 TID:$08
Maximum sensor Voltage for test cycle(calculated) -
Max: -48,572mV/s Min: 8,256mV/s
Test result value: 4,448mV/s
FAIL
MID:$c1 TID:$19
Max: 41,267 Min: 20,512
Test result value: 6,592
FAIL
MID:$c1 TID:$1a
Max: 41,113 Min: 20,528
Test result value: 6,848
FAIL
MID:$c1 TID:$1b
Max: 41,113 Min: 20,528
Test result value: 7,104
FAIL
MID:$c1 TID:$1c
Max: 41,113 Min: 4,144
Test result value: 7,360
PASS
MID:$c1 TID:$24
Max: 41,113 Min: 4,144
Test result value: 9,408
PASS
MID:$c1 TID:$5f
Max: 40,964 Min: 10,432
Test result value: 14,080
PASS
MID:$d1 TID:$1e
Max: 41,113 Min: 4,144
Test result value: 7,888
PASS
MID:$d1 TID:$32
Max: 1 Min: 20,561
Test result value: 13,008
FAIL
MID:$e1 TID:$33
Manufacturer defined MID -
Max: 41,113 Min: 20,528
Test result value: 13,280
FAIL
Thanks for the help. After attempting to clean the incredibly dirty, rusted, corroded, flat out unable to be cleaned EGR (which did not even have a gasket between it and the engine). I have ordered a new one. Reinstalling it with a gasket so the car works until it gets here the car does seem to run better. It has not thrown a lean code in 40 miles which is an improvement but it does show max voltage on the o2 heater circuit for o2 sensor 4. This sensor was just replaced so I can only assume this means a short or a bad installation. Am I reading that last part correctly? — Thanks for the suggestions George I will get the cars charging system checked at Autozone and see what the equipment says as a start.
circuitsmith - The problem was not making the car stall - the cars computer was popping up the ENG PWR REDUCED message and disconnecting the gas pedal (it’s electronic)… The engine then idled extremely rough until turned off.
thanks for all the help!!!
Sean
The latest failed tests are (and I did not reset the computer so there may be holdovers)
MID:$11 TID:$5f
Max: 40,966 Min: 26,816
Test result value: 14,080
FAIL
MID:$50 TID:$03
Low sensor Voltage for switch time calculation - O2 Heater Monitor Bank 4 - Sensor 4
Max: 45,078 Min: 22,546
Test result value: 65,520
FAIL
MID:$c1 TID:$19
Max: 41,113 Min: 20,528
Test result value: 6,592
FAIL
MID:$d0 TID:$03
Low sensor Voltage for switch time calculation -
Max: 45,075 Min: 6,162
Test result value: 65,520
FAIL
Thanks for the help. After attempting to clean the incredibly dirty, rusted, corroded, flat out unable to be cleaned EGR (which did not even have a gasket between it and the engine). I have ordered a new one. Reinstalling it with a gasket so the car works until it gets here the car does seem to run better. It has not thrown a lean code in 40 miles which is an improvement but it does show max voltage on the o2 heater circuit for o2 sensor 4. This sensor was just replaced so I can only assume this means a short or a bad installation. Am I reading that last part correctly? — Thanks for the suggestions George I will get the cars charging system checked at Autozone and see what the equipment says as a start.
circuitsmith - The problem was not making the car stall - the cars computer was popping up the ENG PWR REDUCED message and disconnecting the gas pedal (it’s electronic)… The engine then idled extremely rough until turned off.
thanks for all the help!!!
Sean
The latest failed tests are (and I did not reset the computer so there may be holdovers)
MID:$11 TID:$5f
Max: 40,966 Min: 26,816
Test result value: 14,080
FAIL
MID:$50 TID:$03
Low sensor Voltage for switch time calculation - O2 Heater Monitor Bank 4 - Sensor 4
Max: 45,078 Min: 22,546
Test result value: 65,520
FAIL
MID:$c1 TID:$19
Max: 41,113 Min: 20,528
Test result value: 6,592
FAIL
MID:$d0 TID:$03
Low sensor Voltage for switch time calculation -
Max: 45,075 Min: 6,162
Test result value: 65,520
FAIL